44 replies to this topic

[Asuki]

Homunculus only helps BASE levels. and the homunculus branch is 11 job points total ( vaporize 1, res 5, aid pot 5 - since you fail if your homunc dies or runs out of SP ).



The BS class just whines too much. A non god stacked BS can out damage a non god stacked genetic 9/10 times. Lets see here, arm cannon - relies purely on ATK so only STR is needed, pile bunker has huge ATK... BS does more damage with less stats.

HP mods, BS gets WAY more HP than genetics.... hell my damn 44 vit SORCEROR gets as much HP as my 100 vit genetic at 150. BS gets hovering, takes much less damage from traps and ETC - avoids ankle snare maybe?

BS gets that slide skill, can slide over traps.... genetics get to run fast and can't avoid traps.

BS gets nuetral barrier, reduces damage, magic damage and takes no damage from ranged attacks... hello GoH / CS, nice to see you are now obsolete against mechs.

The only thing that genetics get that is decent is howling, and the catalyst is stupid rare on non over botted servers, 150-300K per cast and you are lucky if hunting em you get 1-2 / hour. Thorn wall is OK in WoE but costs ~500K - prickly fruit in ymir is ~200K( 200K x 10 / 4 ).

thats a load of , a non stacked mech will not out damage a non stacked genetic 9/10 times, only time cart termination will out damage acid bomb is on low vit mvps. And your the biggest retard ever if you think arm cannon is somehow better then cart cannon... i'm not even going to bother explaining to you why cart cannon is far superior to arm cannon.

The hp mod on a genetic is retarded yes, that is getting fixed a bit thou (20k at 150 with 100 vit, thorn wall is amazing, mandragora howl is amazing, crazy weed is ok and hell plants is pretty good, no complaints on the genetic side except for the stupid low hp mod.

Btw this is coming from a 150/50 genetic

And mechanics arent really useless in woe, it just that no one has bothered using a mechanic properly in woe yet, if you look at all the mech skills there clearly build for support at critical battles and mechs are probably only second to suras it terms of mobility in woe

[Asuki]

Maybe you can't read or maybe you just "forgot" the quoted text right above that saying how the "poor" entire blacksmith branch was in renewal.

Oh, and one more thing to add to it, axe tornado may require using an axe.... but it does almost 200% more damage than cart tornado. 650% for axe 350% for cart to be exact.

cart tornado-

Swing your cart around you and strike all targets within 2 cells around you. Targets that are hit will be stunned and pushed back 2 cells. Requires a cart to be used. Cart Remodeling greatly increases the damage of this skill

* Damage Formula is believed to be: 100% + (SkillLv)*50% + (Cart Remodeling)*100%

Skill Level 1 2 3 4 5
ATK increase +50% +100% +150% +200% +250%

so at max level cart tornado does 850% damage and you dont have to use a 2 hand axe with it, meaning u can use a shield and do good damage with it


axe tornado-

Spins about with an Axe to create a tornado which deals damage to all surrounding enemies.
ATK increases by 1% for every point of VIT the caster has.
This skill deals 1.5x more damage if used with Wind property weapon or endow.
This skill deals 0.05x more damage for every base level over 99.
Monsters closer to the player receive more damage than those farther away.
This skill does not hit players using Hide
Lose 100 HP with each attack.


Level 5x5 AoE Damage 7x7 AoE Damage
1 300% 0%
2 400% 0%
3 500% 375%
4 600% 450%
5 700% 525%



I think u clearly need to stfu about mechs and genetics, you clearly know absolutely nothing about both classes even thou u claim to be playing a genetic. If u look at this cart tornado pretty much does the same damage as axe tornado, only difference is that cart tornado knocks back and stuns and u can still do good damage with it even with a shield on since it doesn't restrict your weapon to axe only. Ppl actually used lv 2 cart tornado before intead of lv 5 because it was highly spammable ( much less delay or something).

The only reason genetics don't use this skill to level is because cart cannon is so much better ( best leveling skill in game)

[Wanderer]

As people already said forgers are out of the game along time ago, since gravity never gave them more new weapons to craft and more and better weapons got introduced with newer episodes.

However things like steel being cheaper due to change material has helped a bit with lowering the forging costs and such, but they are still forging weapons for new players only, they don't have any impact on high end weapon crafting.

[soudou]

As people already said forgers are out of the game along time ago, since gravity never gave them more new weapons to craft and more and better weapons got introduced with newer episodes.

However things like steel being cheaper due to change material has helped a bit with lowering the forging costs and such, but they are still forging weapons for new players only, they don't have any impact on high end weapon crafting.

Yep. And now with Eden Quests little to no need to forge weapons that would be used by new players only. They really need to update Smiths. They're pretty much stuck in time to 3~4 years ago or something.

[meoryou2]

cart tornado-

Swing your cart around you and strike all targets within 2 cells around you. Targets that are hit will be stunned and pushed back 2 cells. Requires a cart to be used. Cart Remodeling greatly increases the damage of this skill

* Damage Formula is believed to be: 100% + (SkillLv)*50% + (Cart Remodeling)*100%

Skill Level 1 2 3 4 5
ATK increase +50% +100% +150% +200% +250%

so at max level cart tornado does 850% damage and you dont have to use a 2 hand axe with it, meaning u can use a shield and do good damage with it


axe tornado-

Spins about with an Axe to create a tornado which deals damage to all surrounding enemies.
ATK increases by 1% for every point of VIT the caster has.
This skill deals 1.5x more damage if used with Wind property weapon or endow.
This skill deals 0.05x more damage for every base level over 99.
Monsters closer to the player receive more damage than those farther away.
This skill does not hit players using Hide
Lose 100 HP with each attack.


Level 5x5 AoE Damage 7x7 AoE Damage
1 300% 0%
2 400% 0%
3 500% 375%
4 600% 450%
5 700% 525%



I think u clearly need to stfu about mechs and genetics, you clearly know absolutely nothing about both classes even thou u claim to be playing a genetic. If u look at this cart tornado pretty much does the same damage as axe tornado, only difference is that cart tornado knocks back and stuns and u can still do good damage with it even with a shield on since it doesn't restrict your weapon to axe only. Ppl actually used lv 2 cart tornado before intead of lv 5 because it was highly spammable ( much less delay or something).

The only reason genetics don't use this skill to level is because cart cannon is so much better ( best leveling skill in game)

Dear goddess you fail so hard. the % increase DOES NOT STACK at level 5 it is a straight 250% damage mod. Not to mention cart boots / remodeling does not significantly affect tornado at all, I have tested it. Besides the fact that boost is bugged and adds 50 ATK on ANY attack instead of just cart attacks.

Not to mention where oh where were TRANS skills mentioned at all? Arm cannon is stronger than cart cannon, it just has a smaller AoE. Oh, not to mention arm cannon only needs what 3 skill points to master? And yeah... arm cannon DOES do way more damage than cart cannon. Lets take just plain old PvM into account once: mech with arm cannon 110+( job bonus) STR 50 INT +7 pile bunker using iron cannon balls and wind endow does 18-19K on a titan. Genetic with 110+28 INT and 75 STR using +7 giant axe iron cannon balls and wind endow does 14.5-15.5K cart cannon. Oh, not to mention cart cannon has longer cast times.

And in PvP HSCR still out damages acid bomb because of the retarded cast times and 50% damage reductions against players added to 30% from thara shield 10% form feather beret / poop hat / beret + whatever BG set demi reducs + ranged / immune reducs from being forced nuetral + defending aura ( if there is a sader class around... you know the highest VIT characters that also have the highest DEF and HP in the game that the skill was mostly designed for) + hard DEF reductions + WoE ranged reducs = crap damage at a nice 2 second interrupt-able cast time. I've had a 150 genetic try and AB my 123 genetic ( currently 7X VIT ) for 2-3K with only thara shield and hard DEF.... thats just SAD. The smith meanwhile is HSCRing at 190-193 ASPD for anywhere between 1K-6K+ hits. He gets dispelled he just cart boosts again and goes back at it.

AB is really only good against stupid builds like VIT warlocks / ranger that has no DEF, MVPs or having a TON of them while in strings and level 5 sacramented. Hell plant will out DPS acid bomb on any high level character.


Possibly you should learn a tad bit more before you call someone else stupid I happen to know my classes quite well, bugs and all.

[Asuki]

your a pretty big idiot if u think arm cannon is better then cart cannon, cart cannon has a much better damage mod because it is increased by int significantly. And LOL at you comparing arm cannon 3 skill points to get to cart cannon 5 skill points look at the pre reqs before talking , arm cannon is much higher up in the skill tree then cart cannon is. Also try, just try to find a mechanic that can out level a properly build genetic, its just not going to happen, and the reason is because cart cannon is way superior.

3second cast time on cart cannon means nothing since its all variable cast time, u can reduce it too 0 (that's instant cast if u didn't understand) with the proper stats, equipment and buffs, it also has no after cast delay or fixed cast time. 7x7 aoe vs 3x3 aoe? ya i'll take cart cannon anytime, the only reason arm cannon can even get close to cart cannon damage is because mechs get to use a pile bunker, not because the skill itself is superior. Also don't go off comparing the damage of a pile bunker ( best mech weapon) to a genetic using giant axe thats is uncarded ( subpar cart cannon weapon to start with). You want to compare damage? well I do 25k cart cannons non converted in pve and thats at instant cast. meaning the dps is actually more around 75k/sec in a 7x7 aoe, have fun looking for a arm cannon that can out dps this. again LOL at your cart cannon having a longer cast time there a big difference between variable and fix cast time.

who the hell mentioned AB for pvp, ab is strictly for pvm right now, we got much better skills in pvp like hell plant, thorn walls and howling.

About trans skills been mentioned you said mechs had better dps with cart termination you dumb tard, last time i checked both cart termination and ab where trans skills

I'll repeat what i said, learn the class before u talk your ass off

and no u oviously know jack about mechs and genetics if u think arm cannon > cart cannon, your also wrong about cart tornado and neutral barrier

Edited by Asuki, 27 January 2011 - 03:44 PM.

[Meshif]

renewal is sad for everything except RG and suras

[Asuki]

Maybe you can't read or maybe you just "forgot" the quoted text right above that saying how the "poor" entire blacksmith branch was in renewal.

Oh, and one more thing to add to it, axe tornado may require using an axe.... but it does almost 200% more damage than cart tornado. 650% for axe 350% for cart to be exact.

oh and here a reply to you having tested cart tornado and axe tornado, proves how stupid your really are


650% damage for axe?

350% with cart?

i'm assuming your talking about axe tornado and cart tornado where the hell did u pull 650% attack and 350% attack?

axe tornado is 700% at max tornado level, and cart cannon is greatly increase by cart remodel, so 350% + 500% so 850%

or if we go by your previous post, which i think is a load of-_- btw, it would be 250% +500% meaning 750% damage

see how your 2 posts contradict themselfs?

[meoryou2]

oh and here a reply to you having tested cart tornado and axe tornado, proves how stupid your really are


650% damage for axe?

350% with cart?

i'm assuming your talking about axe tornado and cart tornado where the hell did u pull 650% attack and 350% attack?

axe tornado is 700% at max tornado level, and cart cannon is greatly increase by cart remodel, so 350% + 500% so 850%

or if we go by your previous post, which i think is a load of-_- btw, it would be 250% +500% meaning 750% damage

see how your 2 posts contradict themselfs?

All I see is you being retarded and not knowing a damn thing except how to brag and slap on LoLgoditams. Oh, that and acting like a female dog.

Try some testing out, remodeling does not do an extra 100% per level. never has, with all the rest of the bugs and the RO dev team probably never will. Unlike YOU _I_ did test the different builds, with the different levels.


And about the giant axe not being a good CC weapon on TITANS you must be retarded. the only better ATK weaponswould be a HF or mjol ( for the STR, which is not doing as much as pure ATK :-| ) since SOWRDS may get the bonus from sword training and axe mastery but STILL get size penalties of -25% ATK on large. So 3x ZBC red twinedge ( one of the leading "best" CC weapons ) has exactly 247.5 ATK after figuring in level 10 axe mastery and level 5 sword mastery minus the 25% size mod at +0 . The giant axe on the other hand has 360 ATK with axe mastery 10 and does 100% on large size at +0. Using twin edge on large is as stupid as using giant axe on medium.


Now if you want to discuss classes more you can PM me.... but only when you stop acting like you smell like "Summers Eve".

[Asuki]

never said giant axe wasn't a decent weapon, just saying that you can't compared giant axe with with a pile bunker in damage, if your gonna compare the damage at least use a HF that is carded. I might be wrong on the cart tornado thing since i haven't really tried that skill but on arm cannon and cart cannon your dead wrong.

[Dukeares]

It would be fun (Profitable)in forging again. if some 1 can clean up those *Suspcious Forge vendor...

[BoingBoing]

Surprised no one's mentioned the biggest nerf for forgers, ranking and star crumbs no longer offer chasing damage.

[Krispin]

Probably because it isn't a big nerf at all and hardly affects anything, except maybe deflate a few e-peens.

That ten seeking damage didn't get multiplied with any skill, it's a set ten damage.
The biggest use of this before renewal was bashing people in WoE until they were stunned so they couldn't dodge or pot, which doesn't mean squat now that A. nearly every person you meet on WoE is going to have 100 vit and B. the sowrdy classes finally have better attacks

[BoingBoing]

Probably because it isn't a big nerf at all and hardly affects anything, except maybe deflate a few e-peens.

That ten seeking damage didn't get multiplied with any skill, it's a set ten damage.
The biggest use of this before renewal was bashing people in WoE until they were stunned so they couldn't dodge or pot, which doesn't mean squat now that A. nearly every person you meet on WoE is going to have 100 vit and B. the sowrdy classes finally have better attacks

How is it not a big nerf for forgers when it takes away the main incentive for getting ranked?
The chasing damage wasn't just set damage, it was non elemental. Had a few nice uses in pvm, more so than 'bashing people in WoE'.

[Conjure]

Still waiting for somebody from gravity to reply, is anything comming for pure forger in any future episode or we have to stay 3~4 years back. Back means all the forging skill is same as what was before heritage patch. Nothing new for forging weapon came in heritage (TRANS) nor in renewal.

Please somebody reply that anything coming for pure forger or not.

[MrBudd]

Unlikely man. Being a ranked forger myself, I'm not holding my breath on seeing any changes being made. We probably wont hear anything from the GMs about this issue as they probably don't even know whats up. If we were to get any official word on forging, it'll most likely be along the lines of "we put the request in but the dev's are giving us anything".

[TheSquishy]

I can think of a quick fix for forgers that wouldn't be development intensive.

Make forging manuals that allow smiths to
forge level 4 weapons. Like cooking the Quest Can be unlocked after a certain level.

Make the items requirements similar to those of the umbala NPC
But with different items and different weapons. The success rate would have to be 100% when conditions are met to be fair.
But to keep the market from getting flooded with level 4 weapons set some
base requirements.

Say you want to forge legendary swords...

You have to have max of smith sword, Weapon Research.

-The corresponding manual (Legendary Swordsmith Manual V.1 obtained via quest)

-Lvl 4 weapons can only be forged using emperium anvil.

-A Magical Hammer also needed (Mvp Drop or rare monster drop from dokebis or
teddybears, etc)

Lvl 4 weapons must be created in a certain place (they are magical after all).
Maybe forging a Holy Weapon in Odin's Temple.
Attempt Fails otherwise.

Add a new manual every other update or so.

Edited by TheSquishy, 11 February 2011 - 09:48 AM.

[Mwrip]

The biggest problem with forgers - and this has been true since day 1 - is that there's almost nothing they can do to a weapon. They can give it an element and they can make it "very", but that's it.

Well, now that the veries are useless, and the element only affects watk and is thus useless vs just getting a better weapon, they can do exactly nothing.

The whole reason there's 3 slots on the forge menu is that you were supposed to choose from a long list of effects.

To fix forging, they can't just say "ok, we'll let you make a few of the weapons people actually use at 3rd job". They need to give more than 2 options for those 3 slots. A list of 15-20 abilities would be very easy to code, and would suddenly make smiths sought after, as not only would they have a much wider variety of stuff to forge, but they'd have a ton of people requesting customized gear at a small fee.

[Wolfen]

The biggest problem with forgers - and this has been true since day 1 - is that there's almost nothing they can do to a weapon. They can give it an element and they can make it "very", but that's it.

Well, now that the veries are useless, and the element only affects watk and is thus useless vs just getting a better weapon, they can do exactly nothing.

The whole reason there's 3 slots on the forge menu is that you were supposed to choose from a long list of effects.

To fix forging, they can't just say "ok, we'll let you make a few of the weapons people actually use at 3rd job". They need to give more than 2 options for those 3 slots. A list of 15-20 abilities would be very easy to code, and would suddenly make smiths sought after, as not only would they have a much wider variety of stuff to forge, but they'd have a ton of people requesting customized gear at a small fee.

im loving that idea, i can already imagine, slot space being one of the bonus able to insert, with those who wouldnt want to buy a 3 slot carga mace or a 2 sloted one with already induced element.

or with other bonus as status inflicting or god knows what X player wants his weapon customised as

[ShinobiEX3]

lets close out this nekro

 

A black smith is BS that is all