32 replies to this topic

[Zinja]

Edit: Some of the aspects i had observed over the turn in.
warlock: Primarily role being immobilization / mob control.
1.Quagmire and Frosty Misty being the two most important skills , Reducing ASPD,movement speed ,skill casting time,agi, dex of monsters
2. Safety wall on the hot key to protect self and party members .
3. jack frost only when there are 1 or 2 odd monsters sneaking from behind the party. Its better to use frost nova if you have it, doing this in a mob will only cause you to aggro all the monsters on the screen.
4. Best Skills to use in case of attacking would be Chain Lightning/Earth Strain. TV release even better.

Sorcerer: Primary role being Support
1. Be an SP battery [ it helps to wear a Morpheus set considering you can trade only half your sp]
2. Spam Spell Break high wizard (this is better than M.E and in most cases its best to avoid M.E)
3. Safety wall / blinding mist spam ( especially for snipers)
4. w/e attack if situation demands.

Edited by Zinja, 08 November 2011 - 01:17 AM.

[Tofu]

Ice wall is disabled there. And don't bother using ME on the normal hwiz.

[Zinja]

So what would you do as a warlock or a sorcerer?

[Mefistofeles]

believe me........ sorcerer is just a sp slave, any damage output by a mageclass can be done waaaaaaaaaaaay much better by a physical class with no cast bar

[Tofu]

I'd probably just chain lightning spam as a warlock, and let someone else take care of the snipers.

As a sorc, Spell break wizzies, sp people that need it, spell spam mobs on MS tank. Vacuum/web to save myself.


lol Mefis, you should check out the updated screenshots I posted in the other thread. And stop playing a mage class. Theres nothing wrong with the class itself. It's just not as faceroll as Overbrand/Dragon breath/Clashing spiral.

Edited by Tofu, 02 November 2011 - 11:27 PM.

[MrBudd]

Roles of a warlock:

1. Support dps / area coverage over party. It's a multiple elemental map so what to cast really depends.
2. Safety wall support
3. Bolt the out of things if you are bored.
4. You're not a primary killer. Don't worry about dishing big amounts of damage, concentrate on immobilizing stuff on the party.

Sorc

1. Support dps
2. Tank if you got the balls and a cute linker wife for kahii
3. ME for the 160hwizzies
4. Portable sp battery
5. double bolt things if you are bored
6. Fibre lock teleport the stuff you don't feel like killing.

Edited by MrBudd, 02 November 2011 - 11:33 PM.

[Xellie]

Zinja probably has me on ignore, but I'll post for everyone's information. <3

warlock!

Soul expansion to kill High wizards. (alternative to CS killer)
Safety wall your party mates.
TV at a pinch but the reload time is retarded.
Jack frost for mob control

Sorc!
SP -_-.
SP -_-
SP -_-
Oh, use SW to help partymates
SP -_-
Blinding mist when someone is tanking a sniper.
Additional damage to High wizard when there's no CS killer.

That's really about it. I guess they can fiber / EV enemies if you really need time to escape from a sticky situation.

But the main role for both classes is to not be retarded. Don't break lexes if other killers are working on monsters.

Edit: ME is worthless unless against the (mini)boss HW.

Edited by Xellie, 02 November 2011 - 11:32 PM.

[Zinja]

Earth strain vs chain lightning at the moment ES has consitently more damage and on snipers the most 200%.

[Xellie]

Earth strain vs chain lightning at the moment ES has consitently more damage and on snipers the most 200%.

Just to point out, it's cute things like this that cause parties more problems.
If you can lex one shot things, it's worth doing that... it's much safer, faster and effective.

[Tofu]

And how would it have a higher average damage on other monsters? Mastersmiths take normal, LKs take 70% damage, and everything is just screwed against HP. And ES has a retarded cool down. You wont get more than 1 ES per sniper/mob if your party is competent. Snipers won't even be in the mob anyway.

Just to point out, it's cute things like this that cause parties more problems.
If you can lex one shot things, it's worth doing that... it's much safer, faster and effective.

Lex gloomy CS? Or gfist? gfist seems too slow to be efficient. But I haven't seen CS do 350k damage before. Unless theres something I'm missing.

Edited by Tofu, 02 November 2011 - 11:41 PM.

[Hrishi]

Gfist is the best in my opinion as long as you have strings and a sorc on the ball with feeding SP to the Sura, it's simply efficient and makes the least mess when killing.

[Xellie]

And how would it have a higher average damage on other monsters? Mastersmiths take normal, LKs take 70% damage, and everything is just screwed against HP. And ES has a retarded cool down. You wont get more than 1 ES per sniper/mob if your party is competent. Snipers won't even be in the mob anyway.


Lex gloomy CS? Or gfist? gfist seems too slow to be efficient. But I haven't seen CS do 350k damage before. Unless theres something I'm missing.

Lex gloomy CS is still a lot faster than non lexed gloomy CS.

I do stupid damage on my RK (at least 65k unlexed gloomy), so lets say 3~4 CS to kill with lex. Compared to 6 or 7 because someone is doing retarded things like Earthstrain for 8k damage to break lex.

Fist is pretty efficient, if the champ/sorc are good.

[Zinja]

And how would it have a higher average damage on other monsters? Mastersmiths take normal, LKs take 70% damage, and everything is just screwed against HP. And ES has a retarded cool down. You wont get more than 1 ES per sniper/mob if your party is competent. Snipers won't even be in the mob anyway.


Lex gloomy CS? Or gfist? gfist seems too slow to be efficient. But I haven't seen CS do 350k damage before. Unless theres something I'm missing.

Compared to rest of the warlock elemental skills I mean on an average earth strain covers most monsters .Thing is when you dont have people lexing and matching g fist or cs gloomy. It makes sense for a warlock to do something useful instead of standing there like a
[insert word here] .

This topic is about how they can make meaningful contributions in most situations. Not every situation u get accurately placed lex- fist/lex gloomy. lets say the main killers are busy and you have a monster spawning behind or in between your party. its those situations where proper judgement of what skill to use would make the difference between another regroup or smoothing out another bump on the road .

Edited by Zinja, 03 November 2011 - 12:08 AM.

[Tofu]

I think I'm giving the wrong advice to people, if warlocks are doing like 8k earth strains. I've done over 100k lexed Earth Graves to snipers lol, but I guess if the damage isn't on par with gloomy CS, no action is indeed better than "simply trying to help".

Compared to rest of the warlock elemental skills I mean on an average earth strain covers most monsters

Chain lightning does 100% to LKs (higher than ES), 200% to Mastersmiths (MUCH higher than ES), 25% to HPs (same as ES), 75% to Sinx (same as ES), and 100% to Hwiz.

This topic is about how they can make meaningful contributions in most situations. Not every situation u get accurately placed lex- fist/lex gloomy. lets say the main killers are busy and you have a monster spawning behind or in between your party. its those situations where proper judgement of what skill to use would make the difference between another regroup or smoothing out another bump on the road .

If something spawns in the group, a warlock with what seems to be average iRO mage gear now won't be able to deal with 200k hp before the RK moves 5 cells to the right and clicks it a few times to solve the problem.

Edited by Tofu, 03 November 2011 - 12:16 AM.

[Zinja]

@Tofu , Agreed Chain Lightning Is better for those monsters. and if i can target them i.e random LK/Master smith hovering over the support id sw and Chain lightning waiting for the PRO RK/SURA to finish and come kill it. Making the two relevant and common elements for a warlock wind> earth.

Roles of a warlock:

1. Support dps / area coverage over party. It's a multiple elemental map so what to cast really depends.
2. Safety wall support
4. You're not a primary killer. Don't worry about dishing big amounts of damage, concentrate on immobilizing stuff on the party.

Sorc

3. ME for the 160hwizzies
4. Portable sp battery

warlock:
1. its the area coverage part that made me consider ES .
2. The first thing to do.
4. Jack Frost for the win. Immobilizing being the main ROLE because cant support like a sorc and cant do significant damage.

Sorcerror:
Safe to default Sp battery
blinding mist.
safety wall.
Striking.. / vacuum ( if you have it )
i think its safe to assume a purely support role would be most beneficial to party.

[Hrishi]

As a Warlock your job is to immobilize things, not kill them (unless you're using TV or Soul Expansion on kathys). For this reason Earth Strain is a bad choice. Let the killers fist or whatever, concentrate on your job.

[Xellie]

I think I'm giving the wrong advice to people, if warlocks are doing like 8k earth strains. I've done over 100k lexed Earth Graves to snipers lol, but I guess if the damage isn't on par with gloomy CS, no action is indeed better than "simply trying to help".

The damage is normally good (however 8k retardation does happen in TIs where people think they can just go ungeared spamming skills and gwings), but if ES goes and unfreezes a mob on the party, it's not pretty ~_~

And yeah, some warlocks think that's a good idea, then they btch at the priest Y U NO HEAL?! Dude, because you agro'd 3 LKs a sinx and a sniper and got your shieldless ass handed to you in half a second.

[MrBudd]

And yeah, some warlocks think that's a good idea, then they btch at the priest Y U NO HEAL?! Dude, because you agro'd 3 LKs a sinx and a sniper and got your shieldless ass handed to you in half a second.

^ true story

[GuardianTK]

How many times do I have to say this? Don't use Blinding Mist. If you want to block attacks from Cecil, just have one of your AB's/Sura's use Pneuma. What are you going to do when a monster steps into Blinding Mist and you realize you're not able to target it with GloomyCS due to the effect? >_>

[Xellie]

How many times do I have to say this? Don't use Blinding Mist. If you want to block attacks from Cecil, just have one of your AB's/Sura's use Pneuma. What are you going to do when a monster steps into Blinding Mist and you realize you're not able to target it with GloomyCS due to the effect? >_>

Why is it getting in the mist in the first place? Fiberlock exists. honestly if you're getting raped in 6 directions by cecils, it's better to use than not.
(mind you random parties tend to be stupid and do ADD things) And if it gets in the mist, oh I dont know, just step away and spam fiber on it since it'll be blind? If your priest is smart, they can move pnuema without the party dying.

This is because the randoms I party are really dumb and walk away from my pneumas. Anyway, a single monster does not hurt you shouldn't be dying.

Also: just noticed at the first post.

Someone tell that guy about Hell shields and switching or anti-mediums.

Edited by Xellie, 03 November 2011 - 09:09 AM.

[GuardianTK]

Why is it getting in the mist in the first place? Fiberlock exists. honestly if you're getting raped in 6 directions by cecils, it's better to use than not.
(mind you random parties tend to be stupid and do ADD things) And if it gets in the mist, oh I dont know, just step away and spam fiber on it since it'll be blind? If your priest is smart, they can move pnuema without the party dying.

This is because the randoms I party are really dumb and walk away from my pneumas. Anyway, a single monster does not hurt you shouldn't be dying.

Also: just noticed at the first post.

Someone tell that guy about Hell shields and switching or anti-mediums.

You never know what might be nearby or what is pulled towards your party. I'd rather have Pneuma than have one of the other 5 monster types run into a defensive Blinding Mist and not be able to take care of what's on the party when you realize you can't target it...

A monster continues to attack while Blinded until you're out of its sight, so it's possible to see someone get wiped if they continue to stand inside a Blinding Mist along with a monster. You have a chance of failing your single target skills on monsters suffering from Blinding Mist effect. Not every Sorcerer has Fiber Lock in their build either for one reason or another.

[Xellie]

Situational awareness TK!

I guess it depends on the competancy of the party, but yeah, its not worth it unless there's multiple cecils anyway. Plus we have like 4 MPs in our party so it's not like we get caught unawares often.

The whole it continues to attack thing is why I said "step away" /shy

Anyone who stands still when something is wailing on them kinda deserves it. They'd get no sympathy from me.

[TheSquishy]

I think blinding misting is the best option for too much aggro on top of party.

"oh noes, everyone has to shift over a 3 cells..."

I find this scenario much more favorable than a party wipe especially if you have a sorc
without Fiberlock not teleing stuff away.

Sometimes Pneuma isn't enough coverage and bios monsters have many skills with knockback.
And don't forget about ye ole position lag. Half the time you can't figure out what cell
the pneuma is actually in.

[Zinja]

i was leading a party today on warlock. We did about 150 kills in 3 hours didn't die much. Basic rule was making sure every one stayed behind the M.S tank and not mob anything onto the party. I found Frosty misty and MOA/Quagmire to be a better options in terms of mob /speed control. There was ofcourse another warlock in party with TV release doing pretty decent damage .

I doubt any sniper would rush into blinding mist that a scholar would put on the party.and for any stray that does walk in. there are enough gfists/db to take care of that. i have yet to see Spell breaker spammed effectively to control the hw. i found i was better off frosty and quag the normal hw.

[TheSquishy]

I believe spell break now works on MVP high wiz and only at 10%.
It's suppose to not work on regular monsters and be primarily for pvp.