53 replies to this topic

[Gangstaz]

What he says is true. Wizzies and high wizzies are a joke. Before you get frost joker and other stuff, you pretty much rely on soul strike lvl 10. If you think you're too leet for soul strike, then try bolts.

Sorry to say, using storm gust/meteor storm/LOV will make you older by 1 year before your character can even trans. Those 3 are the main skills of the wizard and high wizard. But they take forever to cast. They really are a big fat joke really.

[ExDarkrb]

cart cannon does not ignore defense, check your facts before you say anything

storm gust? compare that to cart revo when we were bio/alch, yea?

wiz? IM TALKING ABT 3RD CLASS and you dare talk abt wiz!?!

talk abt trolling, you did it well

[sayoko]

cart cannon does not ignore defense, check your facts before you say anything

storm gust? compare that to cart revo when we were bio/alch, yea?

wiz? IM TALKING ABT 3RD CLASS and you dare talk abt wiz!?!

talk abt trolling, you did it well

auto atack its better than mage skills, i found easier to train a sage with 50 str 80 agi some dex and vit + hit gears and a tablet

Cart Cannon Skill Info
Type: Offensive Skill
Levels: 5
Cast Time: 0.5 + (0.5 * Skill Lv.) sec NO FIXED CAST TIME and no cast delay
Target: Enemy
Range: 7 + Skill Lv. cells
Catalyst: 1 Cannon Ball

Defense reductions are not correctly applied to Cart Cannon damage. Hard (armor) defense is subtracted off the final damage value instead of used to reduce damage by a percent.

http://irowiki.org/wiki/Cart_Cannon

Storm Gust Skill Info

Type: Offensive Skill
Levels: 10 Selectable
SP Cost: 78
Cast Time: 4 + 0.8 * (Skill Lvl) seconds
Cast Delay: 5 seconds
Duration: 5 seconds
Target: Ground
Range: Magic
Knock Back: Yes
Area: 11x11(due to the splashing nature of the skill)

[generalCOOLyo]

arullo

before 14.1
Single target

after 14.1 update
ground target

earth grave cast time and Diamond Dust seems to have switched cast times.
EG has longer cast time and DD has faster cast time.

only my observations.
what do you think?

did u notice any damage difference?

[HRdevil]

Just now, I realized that Mefistofeles = sayoko

[aMoore]

Well, I am currently play a Sorcerer. I did ET last night and I am somehow agreeing with Sayoko. Magic is a joke especially to MVPs. I feels as forced to be either Genetic or Sura to be able to kill MVPs.

[Inubashiri]

Just now, I realized that Mefistofeles = sayoko

Yes it is.

[TheSquishy]

So far what I have tested, I'm going to agree that PvP/WoE damage has been buffed but PvM damage remains
subpar if not slightly worse. If you don't have 500 mil to gear your mage, don't expect to be very effective at anything.

I know everyone hates it but sayoko is right about how painful it is to level mage classes.
Yes Genetics are a bit frail, but you can stack a ton of def on a genetic without sacrificing
much in the way of damage. Mages don't have that luxury.

There is literally nothing you can go great damage on to level or solo with great confidience.
It needs to be known that this balance currently tested has not addressed this issue properly.

That is all...

Edited by TheSquishy, 11 December 2011 - 01:51 AM.

[Henry]

humm....when I lvl my wiz and high wiz....i used ICE Bolts....thats it...
of cuz with 2 clips...and its pretty easy to do 10k damage which 1 shot most of the low lvl mobs...
so I dont think it is a problem for a wiz or high wiz to lvl...

[Anchors]

No fun hearing that Diamond Dust will take Earth Grave's place as fast caster complement to Varetyr Spear... What about the cooldowns? Is EG still at least somewhat quick to cool down?

Also, speaking of SG (which I still love and find use for despite its cast time <3 ), has level 1 been switched to high freeze chance and level 10 to the damage/low freeze chance with the patch?

[Gigahertz2011]

if you think wizzies have low hp, check out genetics, renewal made us worse than glass, you guys are still counted as reinforced glass.

Reinforced glass? ROFL. I can't stop laughing. I know what Sayoko is talking about, not a sorc, but when I was wiz, I had severe trouble outdamaging a knight with bowling bash. I don't know why this is even an issue, because it should never happen.

[Anko]

Just now, I realized that Mefistofeles = sayoko

That explains alot. XD

[Luckywhiterabbit]

I disagree. Leveling a hindsight sage was one of the most comfortable and enjoyable leveling experiences in RO for me.

Just get yourself a soul linker and marry them and you're good to go. Psychic wave as a sorceror one-shots just about every standard mob as it is.

Wizards...well, you can comfortably one-shot everything with bolts up until you get past lv 80 (I recommend goats). After that you should be able to start doing turnins, and I see plenty of wizards casting STorm Gust in TI parties.

Edited by Luckywhiterabbit, 12 December 2011 - 07:58 PM.

[GuardianTK]

You have to consider cast time vs DPS in terms of spellcasters vs melee classes. This balance patch does not fix this Renewal problem at all. Any melee class is still going to be able to out damage any spellcaster. This would be a different case if said spellcasters have Magic Strings slapped onto their ass, but without it they are crap compared to melee in all intents and purposes. Especially when it comes to MVP'ing.

Look at Genetics? Although they are a glass cannon class, they are still a cannon nonetheless. Their potential with stacked god items allows them to out DPS spellcasters very easily in a short time span, even more so if they had Magic Strings with them. Actually, you don't even need god items if you can simply use Sprint Rings to get rid of almost all the cast time for Cart Cannon. Have you guys seen the Homunc S coming up?

There's also the case of cast delays. I see none of this on Genetics except for their HoM, and yet I see pretty large cast/global delays across the board for almost all the spells out there for spellcasters.


Spellcasters are pretty good for pvm even with the balance patches, but they'll still suck for MVP'ing in the end. Man I miss seeing High Wizards MVP'ing back in Pre-Renewal...

Edited by GuardianTK, 12 December 2011 - 08:53 PM.

[Inubashiri]

You have to consider cast time vs DPS in terms of spellcasters vs melee classes. This balance patch does not fix this Renewal problem at all. Any melee class is still going to be able to out damage any spellcaster. This would be a different case if said spellcasters have Magic Strings slapped onto their ass, but without it they are crap compared to melee in all intents and purposes. Especially when it comes to MVP'ing.

Look at Genetics? Although they are a glass cannon class, they are still a cannon nonetheless. Their potential with stacked god items allows them to out DPS spellcasters very easily in a short time span, even more so if they had Magic Strings with them. Actually, you don't even need god items if you can simply use Sprint Rings to get rid of almost all the cast time for Cart Cannon. Have you guys seen the Homunc S coming up?

There's also the case of cast delays. I see none of this on Genetics except for their HoM, and yet I see pretty large cast/global delays across the board for almost all the spells out there for spellcasters.


Spellcasters are pretty good for pvm even with the balance patches, but they'll still suck for MVP'ing in the end. Man I miss seeing High Wizards MVP'ing back in Pre-Renewal...

The only disgust I have is that, I wish from the start spellfist didn't require the stupid method it has to activate it. Sometimes it won't actually activate at all since you cast bolts really fast if you have your build right and/or Imp/Siroma accessories. It would be nice to be able to activate it from hindsight proc bolts

[sayoko]

this is usless, the HQ have their favorite classs, just look at GOD items, the only gear that gives DEX cant be used by archer class :/

[Anko]

this is usless, the HQ have their favorite classs, just look at GOD items, the only gear that gives DEX cant be used by archer class :/

Mjolnir can't be equipped by archer class but brisingamen can.

Re: Earth Grave being nerfed. I dun care about that tbh since it is not that useful. If the trade off for buffing diamond dust is nerfing earth grave so be it.

Storm gust is still useful in pvm and woe. It is effective in thors and ni. In woe, of all the skills that lag people it still has the biggest aoe i think. Even with jack frost i still use sg from time to time since it will not break already frozen ppl and it is simply amazing the amount of people that freeze even in high end guilds. The cast time for the purpose of lagging ppl in woe is irrelevant since low lvls of sg cast pretty fast.

Edited by Anko, 13 December 2011 - 08:21 AM.

[Anchors]

The only disgust I have is that, I wish from the start spellfist didn't require the stupid method it has to activate it. Sometimes it won't actually activate at all since you cast bolts really fast if you have your build right and/or Imp/Siroma accessories. It would be nice to be able to activate it from hindsight proc bolts

So, what, like have a chance of spellfist activating on a bolt spell cast (hindsight or no)? That'd be pretty nuts at high enough aspd with double bolt. >D It might make the DPS without a soul link worth a damn.

[Anko]

So, what, like have a chance of spellfist activating on a bolt spell cast (hindsight or no)? That'd be pretty nuts at high enough aspd with double bolt. >D It might make the DPS without a soul link worth a damn.

I also thought the same too. The method of activation is too fiddly given that as a single targetting skill you are already lagging behind mob killing casters. It really changed the style of play of hindsighter. Even though hindsighter was my favourite class i have no desire to make a spellfister.

[CeruleanGamer]

Just now, I realized that Mefistofeles = sayoko

Just throw a discussion about mage class and Mefistofeles will always be in perfect attendance.

[Inubashiri]

Just throw a discussion about mage class and Mefistofeles will always be in perfect attendance.

YOU SHOULD HAVE USED CAPS AND RIDICULOUSLY LONG EXCLAMATION POINTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Anchors]

I also thought the same too. The method of activation is too fiddly given that as a single targetting skill you are already lagging behind mob killing casters. It really changed the style of play of hindsighter. Even though hindsighter was my favourite class i have no desire to make a spellfister.

I haven't played with spellfist myself, but I've seen its cumbersome (though at the time damage-impressive) mechanics in action. I'm a little disillusioned now and I don't really know how it's supposed to be a continuation of the autocaster builds...

Maybe if we could spellfist spells like heaven's drive or something (six of those in six melee hits under two seconds might make good competition against other job2 mob skills for mob control) and retain AoE properties, the whole lack of mob control thing would be taken care of... sort of... and we might have a reason to keep TStorm past job1.

A while back, before I had a sorc of any kind (have one caster and one HSer now), I thought spellfist + HS + PWave and maybe one or two other AoE spells would be enough for fair mob control plus decent DPS against a single target, but you have to tank your mobs for a long time with that kind of mob DPS between the cast times and the spell durations... and with spellfist taking a hit with the balance patch, DPS against the primary target will drop as well...

My HS sorc will probably be 99/7 for a long time /swt

[NeoNilox]

I used to be a happy Spell Fighter, then I took an arrow in the knee.

Since I managed to fulfill my primary target (summon Ventus 3 for the lolz) I can take the eternal rest.

Damn, I'm gonna miss to 3-hit the bradium golems .

[PedroProplayer]

High level SpellFister here.

I hate this class for not having the skillpoints I need for everything I want. Maybe it's just me being too used to being a Knight and having all the skills I could possibly wish for, but it's honestly true. I need to get low lvls of Magnetic Earth and Health Conversion to get points on my supportive skills, and stuff on the Sage/Scholar skill tree costs a lot. If/when we get a reset after the skill balance, I am getting rid of Hindsight and Double bolt, because they don't contribute that much to my damage, even with Soul Link. I think I can get better use of extra levels of Dispell, Magnetic Earth, and actualy having Foresight will be cool(I got to 140 without it !!).

All in all, I am continuing to be a Melee Sorceress, but I'll be going a bit more Caster at the expense of Hindsightless-ness. Hell, I am even dropping the usage of books /w shield and Ventus summon because I don't really need that high of an ASPD.

[Luckywhiterabbit]

I want spell fist to have a small AOE, maybe 5x5 or 7x7 around the caster. It's such a cool skill, but sadly impractical at the moment.