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Wanderer/Maestro Weakness/Fail Classes?


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#1 aznversaiboi

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Posted 01 January 2012 - 08:42 PM

I'm here to explain a brief explanation of what wanderers+maestros use to be able to do.
Woe/PVP
Back then they were able to use DSL to assist allies and protect them selves.
Now DSL sucks big time. It has a lower success rate,weaker effect, and new range? DSL was our 3rd class skill that was useful and powerful. That was basically the only skill that was overpowered and now its UNDERPOWERED.
Siren's Voice uses to be so good and a protection spell. Its success rate uses to be flawless. It would protect low lvl performers from 150's.
Now Siren's Voice sucks. It dont even affect people 150/50 unless ur one your self. When i use it, i still die. Why? Because it misses more often and has a lower success rate which is bull :thumb:.
What performer classes do? Before patch, performers dsl,support, and inflict status.
Now what do they do? All performers really do now is....Use 2nd class skills. What type of bull is that? If you notice, maestros just use that freezing skill and strings. They dont really do anything else. Its really pathetic how we performers have to rely on 2nd class skills. Wanderers dont even do much in woe now. All they do is spam dazzler WHICH can be dodged/evaded with 100vit. Which gives bard an advantage. They can freeze if someone dont have marc card. Why cant dazzler be like that? How come stats can evade stun, but not freezing. If yall tryign to make cards worth more then it would be fair for yall to move 100vit=immunity to stun. 100vit gives immunity to dazzler which is an MVP card job. Wanderers' GK isnt much useful either. If a person has straws to recover sp or have a lot of int for recovery, then whats the point of GK? Strings does way more then GK. Wanderers arent much needed like Maestros.
PVM.
Severe rainstorm. Severe rainstorm use to be one of the best AoE's around. Why does it suck now? I would like to know why. That was our only AOE pvm skill to kill/combat. Now it sucks big time. It hits so little on monsters that wanderers+maestros think they need an elven bow. SR is an expensive skill because it requires ALOT of SP and arrows. At its current state, it shouldnt cost that much stuff. It burns things so bad, that it isnt much funny.
Reverberations. This skill is a SMALL AoE. If you notice, you may pile alot on mobs, and dominion impulse the reverberations and it would only hit once. I have tested this my self and noticed. This is really unfair for us. It sucks so bad no one really even choose to get it. It should really do sp damage like hip shaker did. Add Hp+SP damage.
Death Valley. Are you fudging kidding me? This is beyond the dumbest skill ever. It resurrects people but take away their sp and cost the performer an item worth way more then a blue gemstone. Why should an item be 700zenny if it only res people in a low condition and dont raise them like resurrection do which consumes a 650z blue gem. Death valley at lvl 5 dont even give FULL HP to the target. The dumbest part is, its skill requirement. Which is only use able in pvp/woe.
I honestly accept the fate of performers beign FS classes, but why is it that the dances we use are 2nd class skills. Stupid in my opinion. At least make new dances, dance usage, and just cooler dancing. Why is it that our CHORUS SKILLs require more then one performer? It only leaves performer with one option. Which is to rely on their 2nd class skills. Period.

-Please Fix or try to work on the things mentioned.^^
I support RO alot, so please Help me even support it more. (:

For my viewers: Leave a comment please and please express your feelings too! The more the merrier
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#2 sayoko

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Posted 04 January 2012 - 09:39 AM

no one cares :/ i just stoped playing my maestro
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#3 asayuu

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Posted 04 January 2012 - 12:18 PM

Well, this should be moved to our "compendium", just to not make repeatable topics about the same thing.

DSL - No changes were needed, except being healed by Archbishops. Maybe the "omg circular area" to make a little more risky, I loved the new animation. The skill has a bug, therefore is not working as intended. Arullo has BOTH higher rate and duration. Just smaller AOE and costs gem.

Siren - No changes were needed either. 150/50 should be immune to level 1, not up to level 4. It makes 80% of the sirens have almost no effect, and the ones with effect... 2 seconds. The success rate increased in 5%, but the duration dropped in more than 5 seconds.

Reverb - The problem is not the AOE. BUT EVERYTHING ELSE. 1x1 activation area. Go ask a ranger if Cluster Bomb is a good skill, with the 1x1 activation. Reverb is not instant cast, therefore the monster can MOVE while you cast, then take NO damage unless you blow it with Dominion or... Arrow Shower. Also. SPLIT DAMAGE? AKA WHY THE HECK THIS SKILL IS AOE IF THE DAMAGE IS DECREASED IF THE AMOUNT OF MONSTERS IS HIGH?

I don't care having to use second class skills, as long as they are useful. Why Freeze is so hard to take out, but requires a lv50 card, and Stun requires MVP card and is so easy to cancel? Stun should require 100 perfect dodge to develop immunity~ haha~

SR = Hunterfly card. Rideword Hat. Nidhoggur's Shadow Garb. Those three things were the only which made the skill unbalanced. Since the new formula appeared, I criticized it, because the formula is STUPID.

Ask a Ranger which is the best build for their Arrow Storm casting. DEX/INT/VIT/AGI... Isn't it the old rainstorm build? And their skill cost 48 sp. And hits more than SR, a skill which costs 120.

GK - They need to allow ANY skill to be affected by the skill. YES I AM TALKING TO MAKE GFIST/GOH/SD HAVE THEIR SP COST LOWERED BY GK. That would be a decent buff. Okay got carried away but you got it. Strings is "too good" for a second class skill. I don't know... Transform Strings on a ensemble skill, and give one of the ensembles to be a bard class solo. Harmonic Lick maybe?

Also. OH COME ON. MENTAL POTIONS SHOULD NEVER EXIST >.<

A lot of other skills that do not worth mentioning - Yeah most of the skills are so useless we don't know they exist. We mentioned on the compendium [the other thread], trying to find ways to make the skills useful. But yeah, no conclusions yet.

Edited by asayuu, 04 January 2012 - 12:19 PM.

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#4 aznversaiboi

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 05:03 PM

I totally agree with Asayuu.
Performer classes has become one of the crappiest classes in the server.
We can easily get killed by 2nd classes or transcended classes.
Its pitiful that we have to deal with having that low ranking.
I accept being FS, but being able to do :wave: sucks. Period.
>.> I feel the gms should fix some of the stuff.
Our skills as performers sucks.
All i do as a maestro is strings, and freeze.
But if i was to play a wanderer, i cant do :sigh: with her.
IMO wanderers are pretty suck
All wells though. =O
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#5 Hoeee

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 08:53 PM

And 1 more, Voice lessons... Please don't make most of the maestro/wanderer's skill that depends of Voice Lesson's skill level. Since we have many skills to invest, so we don't have enough skill point to invest Voice Lesson to lvl10.

Siren & DSL

maybe they didn't fix/update the formula correctly, if comparing to the last patch formula suppose affecting chance of siren is increase to 5% for 150/50 maestro/wanderer. But I think it less than 60% affecting on player/MVP/mobs. DSL, if the target int is 99+, it is totally immune to it. As the formula says that the effect that affected on players at least 5 sec, i think its affected on player not more than 5 sec ==...

Edited by Hoeee, 05 January 2012 - 08:53 PM.

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#6 asayuu

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 04:00 AM

And 1 more, Voice lessons... Please don't make most of the maestro/wanderer's skill that depends of Voice Lesson's skill level. Since we have many skills to invest, so we don't have enough skill point to invest Voice Lesson to lvl10.

Siren & DSL

maybe they didn't fix/update the formula correctly, if comparing to the last patch formula suppose affecting chance of siren is increase to 5% for 150/50 maestro/wanderer. But I think it less than 60% affecting on player/MVP/mobs. DSL, if the target int is 99+, it is totally immune to it. As the formula says that the effect that affected on players at least 5 sec, i think its affected on player not more than 5 sec ==...


Voice Lessons is pretty sick. Did you knew Ranger's Trap Mastery gives the same SP bonus as Voice Lessons but costing half of the job points? And. IF YOU LEARN TRAP MASTERY 1 YOU GET 220 FREE SP BY ONLY SPENDING ONE JOB POINT

Voice Lessons' importance on skills should be as good as Dance/Music lessons on their second classes. For who don't know.

50% of the second class skill is affected for the skill level.
25% affected by Music/Dance lessons
25% affected by stats.

The same thing should be scaled on third class skills:

50% of the skill affected by the own skill
25% affected by Voice Lessons
25% affected by job level.

No skills like Metallic Sound should exist, in which 80% of the skill is affected by Voice Lessons. Curiously, all "decent" attack skills are not affected by Voice Lessons [SR/Reverb/GE/DS]

And Great Echo. Please. Please. PLEASE REMOVE THIS DAMN 10 SECONDS COOLDOWN... LOWER IT TO 2 OR 3 >.<
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#7 Akin

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 06:06 AM

And 1 more, Voice lessons... Please don't make most of the maestro/wanderer's skill that depends of Voice Lesson's skill level. Since we have many skills to invest, so we don't have enough skill point to invest Voice Lesson to lvl10.

Siren & DSL

maybe they didn't fix/update the formula correctly, if comparing to the last patch formula suppose affecting chance of siren is increase to 5% for 150/50 maestro/wanderer. But I think it less than 60% affecting on player/MVP/mobs. DSL, if the target int is 99+, it is totally immune to it. As the formula says that the effect that affected on players at least 5 sec, i think its affected on player not more than 5 sec ==...


I would have to respectfully disagree. I think since most of the 3rd class skills are singing skills, that most of them should be affected by Voice Lessons. It just helps to make you choose what skills you want to be good at (either get more skills and have them be less effective, or get a few skills and pump their effectiveness with Voice Lessons). I tend to agree with Asayuu, though, in that Voice Lessons should probably only count towards 25% of a skills effectiveness versus the 50% it increases Metallic sound (it's 50 not 80 btw). That would actually mean a buff for solo skills like Windmill and Moonlight, where Voice Lessons contributes only ~20% of the bonus.

It could be a good idea to have Voice Lessons affect the minimum duration of Siren's Voice and DSL by 1 second (maybe 0.5 seconds for DSL) per level and let it lower the re-use delay of Great Echo by VL/2 seconds. Let it also increase SP stealing of Metallic sound, the SP regen of Song of Mana, and the HP given by Lerard's Dew by (VL/2)x, and we could do a variety of things with the class again.
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#8 ultra39

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 09:53 AM

the huge gap in effectiveness between maestros and wanderers is something that seriously needs to be looked at and addressed. lately, most of the time i've spent on RO has been trying to get that bio3 turn-in done (still). so how bad is it? with our completely jury rigged party setup, my lvl.95 BARD does more to contribute towards getting the ti done over my lvl.139 wanderer. if it weren't for the fact that we needed CP to even kill the hwiz, and if everyone wasn't double/triple clienting characters, there'd be close to zero reason for my wanderer to be down there. does anyone else think there's something seriously wrong with that?
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#9 AhinaReyoh

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 11:35 AM

Voice Lessons is pretty sick. Did you knew Ranger's Trap Mastery gives the same SP bonus as Voice Lessons but costing half of the job points? And. IF YOU LEARN TRAP MASTERY 1 YOU GET 220 FREE SP BY ONLY SPENDING ONE JOB POINT

Not to mention Rangers don't lose 40% of their max SP when they job change. x_x

I dunno if there's really anything else I can add to the topic; it keeps getting brought up with no sign of kRO noticing. Other then mentioning that Severe Rainstorm's damage and new no-gear-switching restriction doesn't justify the huge 120 SP cost anymore. (It really sucks not being able to switch to a shield when you notice your party doesn't target a mob after you use SR, and all the monsters switch targets to you. I should really just stop using SR.)
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#10 asayuu

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:20 PM

@Akin:

It's over 50%, because I said about the effect of VL in the whole skill, not only damage <3

MS 5, VL 0

600% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 110 damage.
4s cooldown

MS1, VL10

720% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 10 damage
2s cooldown.

MS5, VL10

1200% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 10 damage
4s cooldown.

To choose between using MS5 without Voice Lessons and MS1 with maxed Voice Lessons, it is an huge difference~
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#11 Akin

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:47 PM

@Akin:

It's over 50%, because I said about the effect of VL in the whole skill, not only damage <3

MS 5, VL 0

600% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 110 damage.
4s cooldown

MS1, VL10

720% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 10 damage
2s cooldown.

MS5, VL10

1200% MATK
Drains 1 SP every 10 damage
4s cooldown.

To choose between using MS5 without Voice Lessons and MS1 with maxed Voice Lessons, it is an huge difference~


You just posted it, MS5 does 600%, with VL it does 1200%. It provides 50% of the damage for the skill. But yeah, if you don't have MS maxed then the VL portion is higher than 50%.
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#12 asayuu

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Posted 06 January 2012 - 01:03 PM

Not that 720% is a high number after all. An amplified lv10 Storm Gust is 750% each hit, and they have access to way better MATK gears [Destruction is 280, while Rose Vine is 145 while Green Whistle is... 50]

The point is. The skill is mostly known for the SP drain, because even Reverberation makes safer HP damage [for some damn bug, Reverb is not a "ranged skill", therefore is not affected by WOE ranged reduction]. And without Voice Lessons, the SP damage is low to the point of being unseen.

On these settings, I would make Metallic Sound deal only SP damage. Not that a Wizard/Sage/Priest class would suffer anything with a 1800 SP damage every 5 seconds.

I wish they brought the Song Amplifiers already, so we could test how better the skill would be.
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#13 Eressea

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 12:35 PM

Performers' attack power has been reduced so much that Gravity should at least try to enchance its other habilities. What about better debuffing? I mean, Siren's Voice having a 100% chance of working, increasing the range and % chance of Charming Wink, reducing SP consumption of Severe Rainstorm by 20... little changes that would at least try to compensate a bit for the terrible nerfing.

Edited by Eressea, 07 January 2012 - 12:35 PM.

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#14 Tabootrinket

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Posted 21 April 2012 - 07:42 AM

Oh ok...
Now I get it. I got the feeling that I've become completely useless for a while (I came back in the game after almost a year of inactivity with my maestro).

Seriously performers are not only forsaken but now they are also nerfed ?

When will we finally get sprites for our musical instrument/whips ? When will they fix the bug that make your bow invisible when you're a maestro ?

90% of our skills were useless and now it's 99.9% of them.
Not to mention that since the patch, whenever my maestro is in combat stance, his face disappears (just like all the other maestros with the same face).

Heeeey, performers are also ragnarok players ! TTTTT3TTTT

Edited by Tabootrinket, 21 April 2012 - 07:43 AM.

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#15 Trixdee

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 02:49 PM

The class needs to be completely redesigned from top to bottom. It doesn't take much to see that it's one of the worst if not THE worst of the 3rd class in most aspects. :-/

Edited by Trixdee, 06 June 2012 - 10:13 PM.

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#16 CuteFlufflyPony

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 11:55 PM

I know this thread is a bit old, but this issue needs addressing. Performer used to be my favorite class because it was very flexible, you could be a great supporter, but could also become offensive if needed. I really hope the class gets fixed... Our support skills need to be SO SO SO much better. SR, the new formula is weak, I don't mind the damage at earlier levels but I wish it would scale up better at higher levels to maybe something like the old SR. As for DSL and Siren's Voice they were only our two useful skills and now are broken. Sigh. :/
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#17 sedut

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 09:03 AM

Why they need to nerf everything when everything works quite well before balanced patch.

bumping a really old threads. lol
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#18 Nero89

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 06:01 AM

i will help u too on this. i really feel the same way cuz i was thinking to pick wanderer as my first char but instead chose WL after they got nerfed real bad.

rebumping old thread. We need serious help regarding this class
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#19 Whisperer

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 06:51 AM

Seems like this thread is forgotten. I just came across this in Google when I was looking for something.

Anyway, my main character in RO is a maestro and I tend to feel 'useless' in parties. >.< Why? Because I can do pretty much nothing else other than play Magic Strings or use Severe Rainstorm sometimes, which is so weak compared to the Arrow Storm of rangers. It's only a good thing that casters appreciate 'strings'. But that's pretty much it. 'Strings' has been the most used song since I first became a bard years ago and probably earlier than that. The Bard class even got the moniker 'stringer'.

Sometimes, I feel less important than wanderers because of Gypsy's Kiss, which can potentially give players within the area-of-effect infinite SP. As we all know, SP is very important, especially for healers and AoErs, and the dancer class is able to provide for that.

One advantage the bards have over the dancers is the 'bug' which lets them play Unchained Serenade over another song, which in turn 'unchains' or disconnects the bard from the first song played and lets him walk and use other skills freely after Unchained Serenade has ended. However, this is only useful in camping which, lately, has been impractical because of mob spawning inconsistencies and gwinging parties.

Now I have some things I'd like to point out. I might repeat some things in the previous posts though but anyway:
1. Deep Sleep Lullaby (and maybe Circle of Nature) should not be PvP only.
2. Reverberations eat too much SP when spammed and do not even get to hit much enemies because of the 1x1 activation. When they do, the damage is still pretty low and is split. >.< They also disappear too soon.
3. The Chorus skills should just be Solo skills. It's already hard enough to get a partner for the Ensemble skills. And parties don't usually take two performers.
4. Death Valley should not have item costs or should be at least equal to Resurrection.
5. Song of Despair should not have item costs or should be a bigger AoE.
6. If Deep Sleep Lullaby will still be PvP only, Siren's Voice should not only protect the caster but the party as well.
7. Better damage and/or longer duration rate for Severe Rainstorm.
8. Higher success rates for all skills, including Pang Voice and Charming Wink!

I'm only a casual player so I don't really have much knowledge on the other skills and the Dancer class, and in PvP and WoE.
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#20 HeresNatan

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Posted 11 August 2016 - 04:50 AM

revive


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#21 VModCinnamon

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Posted 11 August 2016 - 06:12 AM

revive

 

Hello,

This is the archive section, so kindly do not necro the topics. Thank you.


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