188 replies to this topic

[Hrishi]

GTB. http://forums.warppo...tyle_emoticons/default/happy.gif

[DeadlySinner]

Name one way to counter Manhole that doesn't involve a b-wing. The fact that the only way to get away from a man hole abusing SC is to B-wing is beyond stupid. Other than That SC are pretty well balanced IMO.

Alt+F4

But, all BS aside. Manhole is pretty helpful regardless of which side your on, def. or off. When in manhole, you can't get hit unless you are SFed by the chaser. If you want to look at a 1v1 perspective. Sorcerer > Shadow Chaser IN ALL FORMS. Fiberlock, Arullo, Extreme Vac, Psychic Wave, Earth Grave, Diamond Dust. Unlike chasers, Sorc's have the ability to kill you. Chasers sadly lack in outputting major damage without counting on other players.

[Mefistofeles]

Alt+F4

But, all BS aside. Manhole is pretty helpful regardless of which side your on, def. or off. When in manhole, you can't get hit unless you are SFed by the chaser. If you want to look at a 1v1 perspective. Sorcerer > Shadow Chaser IN ALL FORMS. Fiberlock, Arullo, Extreme Vac, Psychic Wave, Earth Grave, Diamond Dust. Unlike chasers, Sorc's have the ability to kill you. Chasers sadly lack in outputting major damage without counting on other players.

True, white imprison is WAY WORSE than manhole, you need to know how to trick your foe to fall in the whole, PROBLEM, abused in woe...... last 3 times and works as a precast (LIKE 20 MANHOLES BY protecting the way to the emp) manhole as a trap, should be avoid by the speed pot(that would be funny)

[Hrishi]

How is white imprison worse than manhole when you can clear it by simply a status recovery...?

[Mefistofeles]

How is white imprison worse than manhole when you can clear it by simply a status recovery...?

And who will stat recover in a 1vs1? O,O who? a ghost? your mum? they are 12 classes(5 extendeds more) in the game, when the people put senseless things like " just pneuma" "just stat recov" "just dispell" "just Gfist" "Just gloomy" thats "JUST CHILDISH"

Edited by Mefistofeles, 12 April 2011 - 11:04 AM.

[neji2k]

i think manhole needs lik a short cast time but in games i really lik when someone finds nice little secrets n stuff in the game lik who thought of firetrap but i would hate to see something a player thought of be taken away that being said giving it a cast time is fine with me

[Keollyn]

3) Dimension door being useless. (no clue how they would balance this out)

I don't like the sound of this.

[La1234]

Personally I think people need to please stop trying to nerf shadow chaser.

I've been playing chaser a LOT (PvP/WoE/PvM) and I think really all the other damage classes ENTIRELY outclass shadow chaser, so first think about how overpowered THEY are before you look at the shadow chaser! Chaser has NO NATURAL HIGH DAMAGE SKILLS - right now only having fire trap as their best chance, which at max is a 7k spam at a time (which can miss and if it does leaves you completely vulnerable until it disappears) where as every other class can frequently One Shot most other classes and enemies (do I have to point out how many RK easily 100k+ clashing spiral and how they can spam that pretty fast??). All chasers have are the low activation rate debuffs that we hope and pray go off so we might live another day >_<

And looking at the rest of the posts there are people legitimately agreeing with some debuffs (chaser barely survives as it is) but many posters just want to make it easy for their class to just push chasers to the side because they are too lazy to get good at the game and chasers are really the only counter to the overpowered noobs with god items.

Please try not to make unecassary debuffs for the class that can only fight with its defense, and at that a defense is only barely useable as an offense.

- I would also like to add PLEASE NO CAST TIME ON SHADOW FORM! People try to relate it to an offensive Sacrifice but sacrifice
- takes ALL damage, where as there are attacks that go through shadow form and cast time would make the skill useless as an
- offensive skill. I also use it defensively in PvM to put damage onto the party tank if I'm mobbed more than my hp can
- handle.

Edited by La1234, 06 October 2011 - 11:13 PM.

[La1234]

Would like to add - on people wanting to nerf manhole - chaser is a class based on disabling and you want to nerf one of their disabling skills? Other classes (warlock for one) can just disable you AND attack you. While in mahole you are effectively invincible unless you have 2+ people - one with SF and one with fire trap - there to kill you. In addition to cast time or increased radius so you can't spam manhole on someone....ummmm I've seen tactics that are much worse like sorc and their vortex skill that holds you there. It has no item cost and effectively can be cast indefinitely, unlike manhole.

[Mefistofeles]

Would like to add - on people wanting to nerf manhole - chaser is a class based on disabling and you want to nerf one of their disabling skills? Other classes (warlock for one) can just disable you AND attack you. While in mahole you are effectively invincible unless you have 2+ people - one with SF and one with fire trap - there to kill you. In addition to cast time or increased radius so you can't spam manhole on someone....ummmm I've seen tactics that are much worse like sorc and their vortex skill that holds you there. It has no item cost and effectively can be cast indefinitely, unlike manhole.

oh yeah....... and vacum extreme prevents you to use items? the change to manhole its from KRO the developers that made the skill think that needs a change... AND THEY ARE RIGHT THIS TIME.-
Vacum extreme have 6 seconds cool down and you can scape with: earth drive, snap,back slide,flyng kick, front slide etc

Edited by Mefistofeles, 07 October 2011 - 11:24 AM.

[rawsteak]

i have a SC myself and in WOE aside from man hole locking, other skills are just whatever. Masq is a great skill but it doesnt work all the time. With the new patch coming in. its not gona be spammable making it really hard to masq someone that up to par on your level. Divest all is good but the chances are also not high vs someone on par with ur lvl. For the most part, manhole is the only real threat SC has vs other classes(or am i just being noob here?) I think taking away manhole lock and adding global and skill delay to masq. will make shadow chasers veery weak. Manhole lock is annoying, but that is one of the few skil shadow chasers have to be a threat. i have 120 base dex and strip all doesnt work efficently vs people at my lvl esp vs people with higher dex. i think GM should reconsider before taking away manhole lock AND setting delay on masq ignorance. And the fact that SC cant masq MVP anymore which makes SC strictly a pvp or WOE making SC undesirable both in PVP and WOE is gona be uhhh wth?

If someone can correct me if im wrong. am i being tooo noob with chaser? or is manhole and masq and divest our main weapon? And keep in mind even spamming Masq and divest vs people on our lvl doesnt give a very good chance of taking them out. Added with the cast time of Masq, its almost impossible to masq. when you are getting hit my a DPS character i.e. sinx or bow rangers etc. leaving us with divest which has low chance of working. so manhole is the few option we have. and taking away the manhole lock is gona make us not much of a threat at all.

i dont think thats very balance for a SUPPORTING class. Sc does no damage. And there no time to set up traps in WoE unlike PVP. And shadow form is not anything if u learn to ignore it. its nothing but "plz dont atk me" skill vs mature WoE players.

comon mang.~

Edited by rawsteak, 06 November 2011 - 07:23 AM.

[raguiar]

didnt bother reading whats already in here but here we go

im not gonna list whats wrong, im just gonna list what it should be. just add ur own stuff to it

SHADOW FORMATION - cancels after 3 hits instead of 9 or even better, 1. ONLY WORKS AGAINST PLAYERS i mean, its SUPPOSED TO, yet it doesn't. its impossible to get rid of the chasers if they shadow form cades and stones if you leave them alone, theyll fire trap the cades and take it down in less than 10 seconds. might i also add you cant dispell it when theyre linked? very overpowered. TRIPLE the SP upkeep. stealth gets a brutal sp upkeep in woe. i dont see why shadow form takes very little sp. everybody agrees that it should have a nasty cooldown. 10 seconds AFTER it gets cancelled? a shadow chaser can literally never die in woe as long as they keep spamming shadow form

DEADLY INFECT - you should not be able to spread third class ailments. this makes chasers very brutal in woe and completely replaces classes that has the original de-buff. for example, deadly infect using the guillotine cross poisons. ive not see very many GX that actually uses this skill. but now you have a chaser flying kicking into your group and using deadly infect with GX's magic mushroom. theyre pretty much the GX class now. but even better. again, should not be able to spread 3rd class ailments. theres only 2 skills that cures GX poisons and no potions.

MANHOLE - simple enough, disable it in towns. its detrimental to a guild rush when you have enemy chasers manholing outside the castle preventing the important people from rushing inside the castle. no counter for this atm

MASQUERADE GLOOMY - coat should prevent this as well. taking your peco off is brutal in woe. also decrease the chance of it succeeding and add cooldown. maybe 10 seconds? no counter for it atm.

MASQUERADE IGNORANCE - very overpowered in woe. it renders everybody useless. as off right now, there is no counter to this. combined with flying kick, you can render 15 people useless in less than 10 seconds. lower sucess chance and add nasty cooldown.

MASQUERADE WEAKNESS - pierces through coat.. why? and it takes off your important crap too. weapon and shield

shadow chasers alos have no mora gear, no gfist,ignition break, hundred spears, gates of hell, comet, release, arrow storm is horrible compare to a ranger, and very limited on what they can do, if all these skills get depowered and/or removed so people like you can be happy then what do you expect a shadow chaser to do ??

Edited by raguiar, 05 May 2012 - 07:51 AM.

[raguiar]

Personally I think people need to please stop trying to nerf shadow chaser.

I've been playing chaser a LOT (PvP/WoE/PvM) and I think really all the other damage classes ENTIRELY outclass shadow chaser, so first think about how overpowered THEY are before you look at the shadow chaser! Chaser has NO NATURAL HIGH DAMAGE SKILLS - right now only having fire trap as their best chance, which at max is a 7k spam at a time (which can miss and if it does leaves you completely vulnerable until it disappears) where as every other class can frequently One Shot most other classes and enemies (do I have to point out how many RK easily 100k+ clashing spiral and how they can spam that pretty fast??). All chasers have are the low activation rate debuffs that we hope and pray go off so we might live another day >_<

And looking at the rest of the posts there are people legitimately agreeing with some debuffs (chaser barely survives as it is) but many posters just want to make it easy for their class to just push chasers to the side because they are too lazy to get good at the game and chasers are really the only counter to the overpowered noobs with god items.

Please try not to make unecassary debuffs for the class that can only fight with its defense, and at that a defense is only barely useable as an offense.

- I would also like to add PLEASE NO CAST TIME ON SHADOW FORM! People try to relate it to an offensive Sacrifice but sacrifice
- takes ALL damage, where as there are attacks that go through shadow form and cast time would make the skill useless as an
- offensive skill. I also use it defensively in PvM to put damage onto the party tank if I'm mobbed more than my hp can
- handle.

Yes ! Why are people mad at chasers ? they have NO mora Gear, no 1 shot kill move, they are very limited on what skills they can copy , people that play shadow chasers actually have to have a brain to compensate for the skills and equips they dont make for chasers

[4496130525190102970]

I read some of the previous posts. Skipped the rest. I pvp a lot so i definitely know how SC works. I fight against them and it is nothing more than a bully fest. I am a Kage and lemme tell you. I might as well drop my pants in front of an SC and bend over. Manhole and Shadow Formation are just plain absurd. Don't match skill description at all. Here is what ppl who think they know SC coz they have one and are trying to keep changes from happening. I say nerf is in play. Sooner or later. Can't wait.

 

SC upperhands:

 

-Manhole "can" be casted on the player. It is not supposed to. Its not even supposed to be the next cell of the target. According to description.

-SC can use skills during shadow formation. Helllooooo..... Landmines anyone? Again ... they are not supposed to.

-Manhole duration is too long. 2 .. 3 Landmines kill anyone. You just have to watch it all happen. Leave your mouse and keyboard ... grab a smoke and shake your head.

 

I read someone say how to counter SC. Really? What counter? "Leave the SC alone till he/she is vulnerable." Hmmm... when is that exactly?

 

When Ninja came out. People cried. I know... I played way before renewal. Then skills were implemented to bypass Cicada.

 

Do the same for SC. Now when i see SCs die in pvp, I only know of 2 reasons. Unskilled player or not enough job points.

 

So if SC beats every class and every person on a pvp map, they are all unskilled huh? What a bunch of ........ ah screw it. This was my 2 cents.