- note: an example of item balance in order to test pure "class vs class"
or "class item vs class item
" or "class skill vs class skil
How to kill a monk with a sin???
I hope you considered offense vs. defense balance. If you use a +20 weapon, also assume +20 on all armor parts.
Beside that, there are many false statements:
monks can one-shot:
No they don't. They have to build up their Inner Spheres to activate a G-Fist that might kill the target. That's a difference and not 'special' at all. One-shotting means that the first attack is also the killing strike (see Cross Impact below). Sure, a monk can knock the target prone to avoid counterattacks, but they are not the only class to do so.
monks have an OP defense:
Also wrong. Although they get DEF per VIT and have skills that increase the defense by 200%, the mons gear has only one half the defense value compare to Assassins and one fourth the defense compared to Warriors / Knights. Armor refinement it's based on the starting defense, so the monks "benefits" get easily eaten up by that. In the end, all three classes (monk, warrior, knight) will achieve the same 90% defense rate.
Monk's G-Fist combo isn't based on luck:
Of course it is. To complete the combo, a monk has to hit with Lightning Walk, Crushing Blow and G-Fist. One miss and the whole combo is lost. Assuming a 80% hit chance, he has a 0.83 = 51,2% chance to complete the combo. What's the crit. chance for a common assassin build these days?
Of course, hit chance might be higher because everyone prefers VIT and the game currently focusses on damage reduction, not dodge bonuses... but both things aren't set in stone. And there are different things that ruin the monk combo. A short lag, a triggered shield rune, a parried attack, an interruption by others and a hit debuff. Beside all that, this also assumes that the monk can kill with a single G-Fist to start with.
Monk's G-Fist gets other unfair bonuses:
Has a 5% tirgger chance and Heavy Tackle isn't even used.
Additional damage when <20% HP:
Doesn't matter at all. A G-Fist without that bonus already deals more than the remaining 20% HP as damage.
Otherwise we wouldn't discuss one-shots here. So it's just for PvE or "for the show".
Additional damage via Throw Spirit Sphere:
That skill isn't used often in duels (mainly Colo or WoE, when targets are distracted or "guarded")
Also keep in mind that the monk gets a permanent -10% damage debuff due to Steel Body.
More hitpoints / more dodge:
A Warrior gets 13HP per VIT and uses Defender to get a huge Parry & defense bonus.
A Knight also gets free DEF, also 2 Dodge / AGI and gets extra defense / damage reduction with the shield.
Both Warrior & Knights get a free 5% damage reduction with Aura Armor
And Beastmasters get insane amounts of HPs, even more HPs & defense with Grizzly Form
G-Fist deals an OP amount of damage:
No, but that's a bit tricky.
Result: The knight also has 4 step combo, the target is also disabled the whole time and both the average and maximum damage is higher. The cooldown of skills are lower and there's the Aura Mastery trigger. Yet, so much hate against monks.
Result: So in more than half the cases, the first strike out of hide already deals more damage than a 4step G-Fist combo.
Result: Similar to the Assassin, but with re-hide, skill reset and a Combo Mastery trigger. Lacks of an early stun.
Result: Fastest stun, longest successive stun and on overall insane damage makes this class outstanding
Critical Jupitel Thunder after a Wind Crest trigger => 3584% damage
Critical Varetyr Spear after a Wind Crest trigger => 3200% damage
Result: Slow (0.6sec cast speed) disable (Frost Diver), but otherwise insane damage capabilities thanks to a broken JT cooldown.
The potential damage output of other classes isn't much worse.
- A Critical Fireball f.e. can create an insane DoT.
- When in Awake Form, noels can cast two >1000% skills in succession.
- A Beastmaster has 2 disable skills, a 1300% finisher and a stackable 10% armor penetration in form of armor rip
But all of them have in common: They either lack a fast stun or can't finish the targets during the stun.
Unfair Summon Spirit Sphere:
The hardest one to judge:
To understand this one, you have to realise that once a player refined all gear parts, a monk isn't able to kill with a single G-Fist anymore.
F.e. versus Warriors ~25k damage per G-Fist should be the common case.
In order to kill the target, a monk must use Summon Spirit Sphere to reset the cooldown and repeat the combo.
BUT, this brings us to the most significant drawback: Summon Spirit Sphere has a starting cooldown of 120sec
So sure. Monks can reset the G-Fist and might easily "two-shot" Warriors and other classes in potless duels, but only if Summon Spirit Sphere is readyto use. Just heal up quickly between duels and you'll see the truth... monks won't able to kill you easily.
And that's the reason why monks really suck during WoE and that's why there aren't many left on the servers:
You'll need TWO G-Fists to kill targets and even with 40% Vigor, you have 80sec (SSS) between two attempts.
Beside that, I already mentioned that the knock down duration only lasts right after the first G-Fist. Thereafter target is able to act and can use pots while the monk casts Summon Spirit Sphere. BUT, if the target uses the new purple pots (or a Pitcher / Spray / X combo) right after the first G-Fist, how is the monk suppose to kill at all? Then, the second G-Fist won't suffice either.
So if I were to choose between a luck-based Rage Strike that can even kill miltiple targets, a lucky Cross Impact with a 5sec cooldown out of hide and a G-Fist, it surely wouldn't choose a monk.
What's positive about the monk?:
Well, beside the mentioned fact that they suffer from a high cooldown, they also have a significantly lower threat in PvE and the AoE sucks. But, there are some cases, where they shine:
1. Sporadic 1:1 situations (best without heal):
One of the main advantages of the monk is the fact that Lightning Walk has a fast animation time. That means that he usually stuns opponents before they could do the same. Against a Knight's Shield Charge or a BM's Beast Charge, the Lightning Walk will usually 'interrupt' them and 'win'. A noticable exception is a Priest's Judex, that's why duels against priests are an automatic loss for the monk.
A group of monks could be fine in WoE due to their 'first strike' capabilities. But that's true for a group of priests as well. So the higher defense of monks is the only reason, why they aren't strictly worse than priests.
The Colloseum still simulates the old LotS gear tokens, but uses the new stat bonuses. That means that a monk will benefit from DEF per VIT, but doesn't suffer from the downgraded armor values. Targets are usually distracted and a higher cooldown doesn't matter that much as long as you get your regular kills and you stay alive.
But how to kill a monk as an Assassin:
The trick is: Always stay behind the monk... in that way, the monk would have to turn first to attack/stun you.
Start with Cross Impact out of hide, follow up with a Shadow Assault to knock the monk down and follow with a Shadow Strike, Trigger Shadow Armor as soon as the monk stands up to buy yourself some extra time of 'immunity' and finish him with Grimtooth, Shadow Explosion & co.
During WoE, fighting monks is rather easy:
Either keep the "strike a vital point" guild skill up, so that you're able to deal more than 60k damage with a CI out of hide.
When facing a monk, use pots after the first G-Fist and use the "pierce eye" skill to make it very likely that his combo fails.
Edited by Greven79, 05 December 2014 - 07:16 AM.