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[Guide] Road to become the God of PvP


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#1 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 11 January 2015 - 07:20 AM

Hello Dragonians!
 
I have created this guide to promote PvP in DragonSaga as less people are engaging in PvP for the past few years. 
 
Introduction
 
I am an above average PvP player with a W/L of 500:149. Most people call me a farmer because of the ridiculous gap in Wins and Lose but I can assure you that all of these are 100% legit. I have been PvPing for 4 years now in Dragonica, DragonSaga SEA and DragonSaga. Until now I am still PvPing so you guys probably would meet me if you stay in the PvP often enough. I will not tell you my IGN or Class but a lot of people already know. I am currently at level 6x because I don't want to level up and farm my equips.
Firstly, I want to declare that I do not have the best internet connection or computer specifications but that is not required to be great at PvP. Even still, the people in the PvP room has rarely ever been a challenge anymore because of the lack of interest in PvP. Of course there are still a lot of great players out there. I have fought a lot of players who are higher leveled than me but they are always so tanky so I would normally lock them people would call me a noob for locking. But seriously, their max HP is like 50K and my damage is only 3K. It is completely unreasonable to expect me to win such a match without using more 'specific' strategies. Even if I manage to survive, the time would probably be over since I always put the time at 3 minutes to let people run away if they get the Invulnerability bug.
 
I have realized that PvPing has been very hard these few years because of certain latency problems. So I would like to explain how to conquer these problems. But first, you must remember these few strict rules to conserve your sportsmanship and pride in PvP.
 
Unspoken Rules of PvP
 
1. You must never attack the player when the opponent is typing.
2. You must never use potions even if it enabled unless the room leader said you are allowed to use it by stating it on the chat.
 
Note: The rules can be decided between two players before the match, but if you do not know what rules to use, the rules stated above are the most common one.
 
PvP Tactics
 
1. Kill players when buffing

  • People say this is one of the rules of PvP but I disagree. PvP is about fighting with skills and not being a pussy and use buffs. Buff is also considered a skill and not to be classified with the likes of typing. If you can't win without a specific buff then my advise is to not PvP in the first place. It is unfair for other players who are able to buff faster than you to wait for you to finish their buffs when their buff timer is ticking also. I have played with Knights before and they have many buffs, so I would rush and kill them while their guard is down.Think about it for a second. You can always buff while keeping your guard up for example running away and buffing.

Should you be PvPing?
 
Things to Note:
 
1. Do you love PvP?
2. Do you take PvP seriously?
3. Do you play PvP for fun only?
4. Do you have a pure PvP build?
5. Do you yearn for wins?
 
If your answers are:
 
Yes
Yes
No
Yes
Yes
 
Then you should be all set.
 
Do NOT do before PvPing
 
1. Rest

  • You mind will be relaxed.

2. Stop playing for a few days

  • You get rusty and you will need a few matches of PvP to go back to your perfect condition. (I got banned for 5 days before so I know)

3. Off the lights

  • Maybe it is just me but for some reason if it gets very dim, my concentration is lowered by 30%

What you should do before PvPing
 
1. Stretch your hands.
2. Have a positive mentality.
3. Think that every match is live and death.
4. Put or remove any distractions away from you.
5. Make sure your computer will not suddenly tab out. For example, disabling the Windows key.
 
Everything you need to PvP
 
1. Practice

  • No joke practice really helps if you want to decrease the amount of losses you have in the PvP arena. You should be outside of the PvP room dueling random people to get more experience and skills.

2. Create a build that is for pure PvP and throw away everything that has to do with PvE.
3. Always buy/farm Hunter Capsules.
4. A computer that won't suddenly freeze. 

  • Make sure the frame rate doesn't suddenly drop at important times (I have these problems a lot especially when the hunters use their Phoenix skill.)

5. [SUPER IMPORTANT] A stable and fast internet.

  • (Do not use Wi-Fi because if there is someone living at the same place as you and suddenly download some porn or crap, your internet will drop and you will start to see your opponents teleporting everywhere.) Note: I use Wi-Fi so I know.

6. DragonSaga itself of course.
 
What you need to know when PvPing
 
1. You won't always be the best in PvP as people will evolve and change in PvP.
2. There are just some classes (Twin Fighters) you can never beat no matter how hard you work.
3. Always expect the unexpected.
4. Do not let your emotions overwhelm you.
5. Do not rush your levels and aim to farm your items beforehand before leveling up.
 
What to expect when PvPing
 
1. Latency glitches

  • Like disappearing when flinching the enemy as he moves.
  • Snake dashing
  • Teleporting
  • When any of these things happen, just back out and wait for the opponent to come back. Do not follow their bodies if they start running somewhere else and of course be alert because when it happens, the opponent can surprise you by appearing and stunning you or something.

2. Fighting Archers

  • Some of them move so ridiculously fast that even after flinching or stunning, you can still see them run away but a bit more slower. But this time you can chase after the body, because even though I said that you shouldn't chase the body, this one is an exception because for some weird reason, if you hit the moving body, the player will still get damaged but once the stun is over, they will teleport back to their original spot where they were stunned so either finish them quick or be alert and go to the place when you think the opponent will reappear to continue your combo. 
  • Stunning or flinching them will not be easy so you have to predict where they would go. But there is a trick! Archers have this bad habit of jumping around and using Shootdown. Maybe they like jumping, I do not know. Do not try to catch them while they are on the ground, they move so fast so the chance of you catching them is 2%. When the Archer lands on the ground, they will have this 50 millisecond delay so predict where they will be landing and use your catching skill a 0.8 seconds before they land. It will take a lot of practice so you should fight against Archers often. But of course, this tip does not help Archers because Archers can catch Archers easily by using Shootdown and their weird glitching skills that can somehow attack you even if you are not there.

Stats to prioritize on
 
1. Knight

  • Health ***
  • Movement Speed **
  • Elements *

2. Gladiator

  • Health ***
  • Movement Speed **
  • Elements *

3. Hunter

  • Movement Speed ****
  • Health ***
  • Elements **
  • Attack Speed *

4. Ranger

  • Movement Speed ****
  • Attack Speed ***
  • Elements **
  • Health *

5. Jester

  • Movement Speed ***
  • Elements **
  • Health *

6. Infiltrator

  • Movement Speed ***
  • Health **
  • Elements *

7. Wizard

  • Health ***
  • Elements **
  • Movement Speed *

8. Priest

  • Attack Speed ****
  • Elements ***
  • Health **
  • Movement Speed *

9. Twin Fighter

  • Elements ***
  • Health **
  • Movement Speed *

10. Summoner

  • Attack Speed ****
  • Elements ***
  • Health **
  • Movement Speed *

Things you might want to get when build Movement Speed
 
Since every PvP build needs Movement Speed, there are a few thing you would want to get
 
1. Medals

  • Galaxy Expert *** (Defeat Serpent 20 times)
  • Last Action Hero ** (Play Death Match 1000 times)
  • Legend of Combo * (10 000 combos) [See how to get Legend of Combo easily for every class at the end]

2. Character Card
 
Movement Speed +10%:

  • O
  • Capricorn
  • Game
  • Outgoing

How to get the Legend of Combo achievement
 
I have been suffering for WAY TOO LONG just to get Legend of Combo. Why? Because the DragonSaga community suck. I will be the only one who will be telling you this. You can search Google however long you want and you won't find -_-. You can thank me later.
 
1. Hunters
 
Requirements:

  • Arrow Shower
  • Level 1-10/broken bow
  • Very crappy damage
  • Finger
  • Patience
  • 100x HP and MP potions
  • Keyboard
  • Level 25-Max

Go to Water Temple at Port of Winds. You will see 3 extra rooms. Go to the middle one. Move to the top corner of the room where the monster spawns at. Keep using Arrow Shower for 10 minutes on those monsters. Arrow Shower have a quick cooldown and low damage. It also hits a lot. Which means, even if you have a -_-ty computer or a -_-ty internet, you should be able to do it.
 
2. Priests
 
Requirements:

  • Diffusion Cannon/Double Shot
  • Level 1-10/Broken staff
  • Finger
  • Keyboard
  • 100x HP and MP potions
  • Patience
  • Level 25-Max
  • Stable internet connection
  • Above average computer

This one is much harder to do and I totally do not advise you doing this but it is possible and I have tried it. But failed at Uber Combo after 20 tries. But if you will want to go then go to the Water Temple at Port of Winds and you will see 3 extra rooms in the map. Go to the middle one and start X attacking the mobs. It makes you stress and nervous so seriously, unless you are 100% sure your computer/internet won't be a bitch with you, you SHOULD (10% chance) be able to do it.
 
3. All classes
 
Requirements:

  • Level 40-Max
  • Finger
  • Keyboard
  • Above average computer
  • x100 MP potions
  • Patience

If you are a Hunter, I recommend you not to do it since it is way more easier to do the one I typed above. This works for all classes and is what I recommend the most for every class except Hunters. Get a party of 2 or more in any F7. Save as much points as you can and only use points when necessary like don't get the speed buff. Use a build that doesn't use as much points as the other builds. At stage 49, destroy everything and put 5 Freeze towers down. Make sure its 1 by 5, meaning put 1 Freeze towers down and put the other 5 opposite the lone Freeze towers. Get the lone Freeze tower to level 10 and the other 4 to level 3. Make sure the 5 level 3 Freeze towers are close together. Start the round and the Freeze tower will slow down the mobs till they are unable to move. This works because the Freeze effect stacks and when the mobs get 2 Freeze effect, it will stop moving. 

 

How to make a bad internet not so bad

 

All these programs I am about to show you are highly trusted. But if you don't believe me, you can either not download it or do your research. It is your choice. You can tell from the link that they are already trusted. I will also not be responsible if you are stupid and mess your computer up. If you follow the steps properly, you will not mess anything up.

 

Download:

 

To use TCP Optimizer

 

1. Click on TCP Optimizer.

2. Click on MTU/Latency.

3. Click on Largest MTU. They will start pinging the server to get your MTU.

4. At the end, they will say "You can set your MTU to XXXX" Every internet's MTU varies but some time they can be the same.

5. Go back to General Settings.

6. Type your MTU at the place they ask you to type your MTU. (Don't be blind)

7. Click on Optimal at "Choose Settings" or you can just go Google the best settings for Gaming but if you are lazy, just choose Optimal.

 

How to make a bad computer not so bad

 

Download:

I am pretty sure you are able to set the settings up yourself if you are not stupid so I do not think I need to explain. Oh yeah. In case you haven't noticed, all these picture are all from my computer. So if I am able to use it without any problems, so should you.

 

In conclusion, I hope most of you learn a thing or two from this guide and help me ask other players to PvP. But one can only be good at PvP when one is passionate.
 
P.S. Feel free to criticize
 
Legend
The number of " * " is how much you should prioritize on.


Edited by xCroSsLuMi, 05 May 2019 - 02:53 AM.

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#2 Rabbicarpo2011

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Posted 13 January 2015 - 01:02 PM

FYI all servers have their variation of whats ok to do in pvp. 


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#3 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 14 January 2015 - 12:12 AM

FYI all servers have their variation of whats ok to do in pvp. 

I am only stating the common rules. Rules can be decided between the players and is not for me to decide. I am only giving them some rules if they do not know what rules to use.


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#4 Infin1te

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Posted 17 January 2015 - 03:14 AM

There's one pure pvp guild in the server, go fight them if you want your fulfillment.


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#5 stiffyliffyriffy

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Posted 17 January 2015 - 09:47 PM

level up and join the madness in level 61-65 bsq. 


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#6 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 08:49 AM

There's one pure pvp guild in the server, go fight them if you want your fulfillment.

 

One? Aren't you missing mine? xD


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#7 Miname

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 07:36 PM

So this is what it's come to.


Edited by Miname, 30 January 2015 - 07:37 PM.

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#8 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 07:46 PM

So this is what it's come to.

Wot?


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#9 Miname

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 07:59 PM

Wot?

 

Don't worry about it. I'm an artifact from a different era.


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#10 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 08:24 PM

Don't worry about it. I'm an artifact from a different era.

Wot?


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#11 Miname

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 08:37 PM

I don't see you in any pvp rooms.


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#12 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 08:53 PM

So this is what it's come to.

I don't use this as my IGN. I stated it at the introduction already.


Edited by xCroSsLuMi, 30 January 2015 - 08:54 PM.

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#13 Miname

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 09:30 PM

I don't use this as my IGN. I stated it at the introduction already.

 

What that you who I was just in a few games with?

 

P.S. VModPopcorn if you are reading this feel free to delete any off-topic posts.


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#14 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 30 January 2015 - 09:46 PM

What that you who I was just in a few games with?

 

P.S. VModPopcorn if you are reading this feel free to delete any off-topic posts.

No. I am currently not in DragonSaga since I am so busy responding to you and updating the posts.


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#15 Popcorn

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 11:45 AM

Very interesting information what you put under the "How to make a bad internet not so bad part".

But in my opinion it is not needed to download the DNS benchmarker, because if a game (and so will do the most) connects directly a specific IP address (and Dragon Saga does this, too) no DNS is involved. As the name says it's a "Domain Name Server" and it's used to resolve a host name to the matching IP address. If you connect directly to an IP address, domain name resolving is not needed and therefore a DNS in not involved. 

Just to play Dragon Saga, this program is not helpful. But if you want to find bottlenecks in your internet connection in general, for example because the connection to a web page is very slow, such program may be useful to check if the DNS is bad.

 


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#16 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 10:51 PM

Very interesting information what you put under the "How to make a bad internet not so bad part".

But in my opinion it is not needed to download the DNS benchmarker, because if a game (and so will do the most) connects directly a specific IP address (and Dragon Saga does this, too) no DNS is involved. As the name says it's a "Domain Name Server" and it's used to resolve a host name to the matching IP address. If you connect directly to an IP address, domain name resolving is not needed and therefore a DNS in not involved. 

Just to play Dragon Saga, this program is not helpful. But if you want to find bottlenecks in your internet connection in general, for example because the connection to a web page is very slow, such program may be useful to check if the DNS is bad.

I see. Thank you for the information, I will keep it in mind.


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#17 Miname

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Posted 01 February 2015 - 12:48 AM

He's right. Just set DNS servers to Google DNS and you should be fine (8.8.8.8 & 8.8.4.4). This only affects the actual address translation from domain name to IP however.

 

Furthermore TCPOptimizer is pretty useless. I don't recommend playing around with the MTU size. Just keep Windows' MTU discovery enabled and let it do it's job automatically.


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#18 Popcorn

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Posted 01 February 2015 - 01:07 AM

 

 

Furthermore TCPOptimizer is pretty useless. I don't recommend playing around with the MTU size. Just keep Windows' MTU discovery enabled and let it do it's job automatically.

 

I totally agree. In the past days, ISDN and analog data transfer (Modem) were the best what we had in connecting to the internet and the connections were less stable, changing the MTU size was helpful sometimes. But in these days of DSL and cable connections, it's better letting the OS choose the MTU sizes. 


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#19 ohsnap

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Posted 01 February 2015 - 11:38 AM

Elements should always be a priority over any other stat we are talking about hitting up to 2k per hit for a lvl 6X and 3-5k per hit for a lvl 8X. You also need to be able to stack the resistance to tank those hits. Every other stat is based on style of play. As archer you're gonna have to give up some hp to go for more movement speed and attack speed. As mage you're gonna have to give up some attack speed for more hp. The way the game is going now is prioritize on element damage and resistance to that damage then balance out all the other stats and get the best build possible through that balance.Even as lvl 8X you still wanna hit around 10k aim to hit anyone at 100% chance without a miss. The server is also capped at 60fps no matter how great your cpu is or how great your attack speed is you can only do so much.


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#20 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 12:13 AM

He's right. Just set DNS servers to Google DNS and you should be fine (8.8.8.8 & 8.8.4.4). This only affects the actual address translation from domain name to IP however.

 

Furthermore TCPOptimizer is pretty useless. I don't recommend playing around with the MTU size. Just keep Windows' MTU discovery enabled and let it do it's job automatically.

 

Google DNS isn't that good since a lot of people use it. OpenDNS is better :/ Windows MTU discovery isn't that reliable either. Because default is 1500 for every computer.


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#21 Miname

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 01:11 PM

Google DNS isn't that good since a lot of people use it. OpenDNS is better :/ Windows MTU discovery isn't that reliable either. Because default is 1500 for every computer.

 

The point isn't whether google dns or opendns is better. It literally doesn't matter and has zero effect on gameplay. What bothers me is having people download these dubious programs to fidget with settings that shouldn't be messed with in the first place. The average user is set to lose more performance by downloading and running this crap then they are set to gain by leaving the stuff alone in the first place.

 

Most home routers allow a max MTU size of 1500 bytes. In fact there is a distinct tradeoff between higher MTU sizes and latency. Furthermore larger packet sizes can cause all sorts of issues that degrade layer three performance. More chance of error/longer retransmit times/higher latency/possibility of fragmentation it's just not worth it.

Remember that TCP is designed to be reliable and connection-oriented. What about the scenario where you establish a maximum MTU size along a route to the host but then your route is altered mid-stream and suddenly you're connecting through a node with a lower maximum MTU size?


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#22 Popcorn

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 01:24 PM

And I wanted to mention that many games do not use the TCP/IP protocol due to data transfer overhead.

Often UDP protocol is used instead.

 


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#23 Miname

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 04:19 PM

And I wanted to mention that many games do not use the TCP/IP protocol due to data transfer overhead.

Often UDP protocol is used instead.

 

This and FreeType fonts is really grating. Although given that this game is probably written in derivative of C I can understand and empathize with the agony of writing the UDP sockets and dealing with error detection and packet loss/ordering. Although it is fun to watch you character bounce around the screen after a lag spike.


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#24 xCroSsLuMi

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Posted 03 February 2015 - 12:09 AM

The point isn't whether google dns or opendns is better. It literally doesn't matter and has zero effect on gameplay. What bothers me is having people download these dubious programs to fidget with settings that shouldn't be messed with in the first place. The average user is set to lose more performance by downloading and running this crap then they are set to gain by leaving the stuff alone in the first place.

 

Most home routers allow a max MTU size of 1500 bytes. In fact there is a distinct tradeoff between higher MTU sizes and latency. Furthermore larger packet sizes can cause all sorts of issues that degrade layer three performance. More chance of error/longer retransmit times/higher latency/possibility of fragmentation it's just not worth it.

Remember that TCP is designed to be reliable and connection-oriented. What about the scenario where you establish a maximum MTU size along a route to the host but then your route is altered mid-stream and suddenly you're connecting through a node with a lower maximum MTU size?

1. I am not necessarily talking about DragonSaga only. Like what VMPopcorn said. I said "How to make your internet not so bad" I didn't say how to make your DragonSaga connection not so bad.

 

2. Just save it in the D drive then it won't affect the performance.

 

3. Smaller packet size lets it transmit faster but has more chances of error.

 

4. That is why it chooses the one for your router. I change my router many times and from how I see it, all of them has different MTU sizes :/


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#25 Miname

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Posted 04 February 2015 - 02:01 PM

Actually, larger packet sizes have a higher chance of errors.

ASFAIK Netgear routers, at least in my experience, allow only a max of the default of 1500.
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