518 replies to this topic

[ZeroTigress]

On a more serious note knowledge of of a game really doesn't matter when some users or posts are clear violations of the rules. If you're being an ass and causing drama then any of the mods is going to mod you for being an ass and causing drama, rules are rules it really shouldn't matter if someone from RO,DS,RQ,Rose, or RO2 makes the call for the most part. One of the reasons for the game specific mods was for helping with technical issues,ingame questions and the such.

I,personally, will jump to another section when either the reports from that section have been sitting for an usually amount of time and need to be taken care of, when a large amount of reports start flooding in and the mods that frequent that section arent around and it's getting bad, or if another VM asks me to because they are unsure what to do or feel uncomfortable with the sitution.

If a post is violating forum rules, then the moderation should note that specifically and link to the forum rules themselves in order to erase any semblance of bias. This would also cease any potential backtalk that the VMods are afraid of escalating. But in cases where posts are on-topic and aren't breaking the established forum rules, there shouldn't be any moderation done just because the VMod doesn't like the topic and decides to abuse their mod powers for the heck of it.

What is all boils down to is professionalism and consistency. The Volunteer Mod Program was established to help the CMs manage the community and if a VMod's actions are detrimental to that and/or even making the CMs' and other VMods' job even harder than it needs to be, then that VMod needs to have their powers revoked, end of story. This thread wouldn't even need to exist if problematic VMods were dealt with and issues were nipped in the bud. But that's not what happened and it's disappointing it has taken so many months for this problem to finally be addressed.

Create reasonable moderator guidelines that are consistent across the board and put an end to the unprofessionalism displayed by problematic VMods. Consolidate all the VMods into a proper group and remove redundant groups. Remove VMod status from users that are no longer active. Basically, clean up your act. That is what the entire Volunteer Mod Program as a whole needs.

[Tkwan]

There's almost no such thing as a low profile guild (especially not on classic!). Everybody knows somebody tbh. Most people fully involved in "RO life" will be part of a guild, recognized for one reason or another (big guild? power tripping/gm bias. small guild? don't know crap about the game). There is a problem with sidelining players for being involved, it would be better to spread representation.

 

Well thats a bit all inclusive. I don't personally belong to a large guild, but aside from the content after the hero's trail 1 update, I have a fairly good knowledge and understanding of the workings of the game. I know zero is also in a small guild but has good knowledge as well. I'm sure there's other users on the forums also that I havn't personally associated with much that are in small guilds, but understand the games mechanics to a similar degree. Your blanket statement presumes that everyone who knows the game is in a large woe guild, but thats just not the case.

 

I'm not trying to take a smack at you here or anything, just enlightening you that there are people who frequent the forums that don't have a stake in the woe or large guild scene.

People associated with high profile guilds shouldn't have been considered anyways because that's just asking for trouble.

 

I thought this was part of the required criteria for the last initiation of vmods anyway.

Edited by Tkwan, 06 April 2015 - 01:03 PM.

[Cinquine]

some of the newer VMods should've had their mod powers stripped a LONG time ago and yet they're still here. 

 

The mod that prompted this thread has been a mod for well over a year. I haven't had any issues with the newer mods, but rather the older ones.

 

One of the mods that was constantly complained about posted pretty frequently about having emotional breakdowns among other things.

A lot of these posts were from the actual moderator account and should have been red flags.

 

Keeping moderators bound to policing forums for the games they have experience with would help a lot imo.

 

This. It has happened on more than one occasion.

 

And then there's the issue of VMod behavior just screaming to have their mod powers revoked and yet they're still here after screwing up so many times with mod powers fully intact.

VMods have the power to mod every section of the forums, but for some reason this kind of advertisement was done exclusively in the RO2 section and I feel it's been this section of the forums that is the origin for the current mod problems.

 

Most of these issues could have been avoided with section restriction, as these scandals seem to only happen around a particular RO2 moderator ~_~.

 

I,personally, will jump to another section when either the reports from that section have been sitting for an usually amount of time and need to be taken care of, when a large amount of reports start flooding in and the mods that frequent that section arent around and it's getting bad, or if another VM asks me to because they are unsure what to do or feel uncomfortable with the sitution.

 

I don't think it is a problem to have global moderators, I just think it should be something that is worked up to, not given right away. The named moderators have been around for a while. Maybe they could do it so once a VMod has been around for a certain period of time successfully, they can graduate to global named mods (if they choose to)?

 

That's why section modding is much better, the mod can build up a history with the users, which doesn't actually exist here... so that's why people get away with things for a long time, until someone gets tired of it. The only "history" kept here is hidden post (which just get deleted now YAY! - who editted my profile to remove deletion notifications? you're sneaky), when the ongoing harassment is edited out and those users never punished.

 

I agree section modding would be better. I wonder if there is some kind of add-on for IPB that can let users know the reasons why their posts were hidden or edited privately. That would be a super helpful feature.

[Alaska]

I don't think it would be fair to punish someone because of what guild they choose to associate with, especially in that case a lot of viable candidates would be overlooked. It's basically saying "you can mod, but don't actually get involved in a big part of the game." in a sense.

 

Mods should be members of the community who are mature enough to detach themselves when the need arises - or avoid modding things they don't think they're fit to mod, and leave it to one of the other ones.

Edited by Alaska, 06 April 2015 - 01:18 PM.

[Tkwan]

I don't think it would be fair to punish someone because of what guild they choose to associate with, especially in that case a lot of viable candidates would be overlooked. It's basically saying "you can mod, but don't actually get involved in a big part of the game." in a sense.

 

Mods should be members of the community who are mature enough to detach themselves when the need arises - or avoid modding things they don't think they're fit to mod, and leave it to one of the other ones.

 

I'm not suggesting they should be, I just recall that being part of the selection criteria the last time Oda had the applications up (and refuting that every person who knows anything about the game belongs to a big guild).

[TEDDYBEE]

I know a VM, who always judges every QQ threads and sometimes threating ppl with "Close Topic" 

 

It supprised me when i saw this topic without her paticipation

 

then i suddenly understand why

 

 

speakless

[ZeroTigress]

How I feel the Volunteer Mod Program should be run:

• Prospective moderators are promoted from within the community based on post history and game history (special attention should be made on those tied to high profile guilds). Moderators must then be shown the established moderator guidelines and asked to adhere to those guidelines for the duration of their term as moderators.
• Once promoted, new moderators are restricted to modding within their game community. (Ragnarok Moderator, Requiem Moderator, ROSE Moderator, or Dragon Saga Moderator)
• After at least year of active moderation, section moderators can be nominated for promotion to global moderators based on post history. (WarpPortal VM) CMs from ALL game sections should be in approval of global moderator nominees since global moderators affect all forum sections.
• Moderators who have ceased forum activity for more than 3 months are to be demoted back to Members. (VMod account passwords should be reset.) They may reapply to be moderators if they return with good standing.
• Moderators who violate the moderator guidelines set forth are to be warned on the first and second offenses. Third and continuous offenses are calls to revoke moderator status and demote to Members. Moderator reapplication should be denied to offenders.

If the VMod#/food accounts are not going to be wiped, this would be the best course of action concerning new VMods. More restrictions on usage of VMod#/food accounts need to be in place to protect anonymity. That means all VMod#/food accounts should have the same signature linking to WarpPortal Support, the appropriate technical sections, and the Forum Rules of Conduct. Aside from avatars, no other form of personalization of VMod#/food accounts should be made to the accounts. If you're serious about maintaining a sense of anonymity by accepting a VMod#/food account, then you should keep that sense of anonymity on the account itself. It's very contradicting to say you want a VMod#/food account to be anonymous but behave in a way to allow people to know who you are.

[Alaska]

I'm not suggesting they should be, I just recall that being part of the selection criteria the last time Oda had the applications up (and refuting that every person who knows anything about the game belongs to a big guild).

 

Oh, that wasn't directed at you. :x Was to something someone said earlier, but I didn't get a chance to reply to until then.

[Xellie]

I don't think it would be fair to punish someone because of what guild they choose to associate with, especially in that case a lot of viable candidates would be overlooked. It's basically saying "you can mod, but don't actually get involved in a big part of the game." in a sense.

 

Mods should be members of the community who are mature enough to detach themselves when the need arises - or avoid modding things they don't think they're fit to mod, and leave it to one of the other ones.

 

No, everyone should cower to mob justice and bias should be applied preemptively against the ones accused of having favouritism as to prevent the accusations and give power to the trolls who know they hold this accusation over the heads of the staff. #logical
 

[Necrohealiac]

I know a VM, who always judges every QQ threads and sometimes threating ppl with "Close Topic" 
 
It supprised me when i saw this topic without her paticipation
 
then i suddenly understand why
 
 
speakless

winter is over, time to bust out the tin foil hats.

[Alaska]

No, everyone should cower to mob justice and bias should be applied preemptively against the ones accused of having favouritism as to prevent the accusations and give power to the trolls who know they hold this accusation over the heads of the staff. #logical
 

 

Daaang always one step ahead!

[Xellie]

Daaang always one step ahead!

 

don't mind me
 

[Alathea]

I understand about the need for consistency in moderation. If one section or thread gets treated differently another one and mods do moderation differently, it makes it difficult for posters to know how to behave. I will be using the feedback posted here to improve volunteer training and add more specific guidelines. I think our definitions of moderation abuse and power tripping will differ but it seems clear from the responses here that more clear boundaries and defined roles for the moderation of the forums would be useful. 

I appreciate that you have acknowledged the problem and is improving the volunteer training. I do hope that these words are not empty and that this thread has truly opened your eyes to the disgruntled memberbase of how some VMods are indeed not following the guidelines that you yourself posted.

 

Our definitions of moderation abuse and power tripping should be set to where everyone is in the same page so that if a VMod ever does commit these mistakes, we, the community, can appropriately and aptly put it to your attention. No one wants to be dismissed or ignored for an issues where they feel are legitimate while the one reported to thinks it's petty. Clarity will not only help the members but also within the internal staff i.e. CMs, VMods, Mods, etc. so that unnecessary friction can be avoided,

 

P.S.Ironic how the fear of mob justice. lol

[kingarthur6687]

As one of the key points of the VMod#/Food program is a clear separation and restriction of personal thoughts and opinions from official moderator business, I believe behavior like the following should be more thoroughly checked and regulated by the CMs and administrators:

 

As someone who is supposed remain anonymous, no IGN for you. I no longer use my personal. Just mention VM11.

 

Emphasis bold. This is a quote from a post available to the public as of April 6th, 2015, 7:00pm PST and is very easily searched for, so I would think that specifying a name and post here as an example of potentially problematic behavior won't be an issue.

[ShinobiEX3]

How I feel the Volunteer Mod Program should be run:

• Prospective moderators are promoted from within the community based on post history and game history (special attention should be made on those tied to high profile guilds). Moderators must then be shown the established moderator guidelines and asked to adhere to those guidelines for the duration of their term as moderators.
• Once promoted, new moderators are restricted to modding within their game community. (Ragnarok Moderator, Requiem Moderator, ROSE Moderator, or Dragon Saga Moderator)
• After at least year of active moderation, section moderators can be nominated for promotion to global moderators based on post history. (WarpPortal VM) CMs from ALL game sections should be in approval of global moderator nominees since global moderators affect all forum sections.
• Moderators who have ceased forum activity for more than 3 months are to be demoted back to Members. (VMod account passwords should be reset.) They may reapply to be moderators if they return with good standing.
• Moderators who violate the moderator guidelines set forth are to be warned on the first and second offenses. Third and continuous offenses are calls to revoke moderator status and demote to Members. Moderator reapplication should be denied to offenders.

If the VMod#/food accounts are not going to be wiped, this would be the best course of action concerning new VMods. More restrictions on usage of VMod#/food accounts need to be in place to protect anonymity. That means all VMod#/food accounts should have the same signature linking to WarpPortal Support, the appropriate technical sections, and the Forum Rules of Conduct. Aside from avatars, no other form of personalization of VMod#/food accounts should be made to the accounts. If you're serious about maintaining a sense of anonymity by accepting a VMod#/food account, then you should keep that sense of anonymity on the account itself. It's very contradicting to say you want a VMod#/food account to be anonymous but behave in a way to allow people to know who you are.

 

Agreed

[Sandyman]

In the End everybody can contribute. Be it In-Game or at the Forum. You only have to be willing right?

So how can i achieve a more willing Atmosphere?

 

"Titles" and "Groups" for the Community can contribute as a role model or as a bridge builder.

Generally spoken everybody has a better and more constructive Time when the Atmosphere feels friendly. 

 

 

However kindness alone is not enough, when Money is involved it creates expectations, the Staff or reference Person should be able to Answer to that.

Usually this should be no Problem. But what happens when the Product changes dramatic over the Years?

 

Generically spoken Changes are inevitable but when the Consumer expect a Sweet flavor and the Product occurs more and more Sour.

Then there is some necessity to talk into my Eyes.

 

In the Past our Community had always a Counterpart. However that Person was simply helpless against the Person in charge.

Now it`s a different Story, now YOU ARE the Person in charge. 

 

As a Player it often feels like nothing happen or goes fast enough, we don`t know how long it takes to create new Content , we only expect more and more acting sometimes very ungrateful for what we received already. It`s really never easy to please everybody. 

We simply expect it like a Miracle to happen, preferable over Night. 

 

 

But with some Luck we do share the same passion...if YOU love your Job - like WE love our Game...then we will recognize it!

If you had Fun programing, creating future Content for us...we will see and repay you with <3

 

Let there be Love.

 

 

Special thanks goes Helium and Blueberry for keeping up with us - not forgotten are Sakana and Shazam0. 

 

 

 

 

 

[MilkyThief]

Honestly, I'm sleepy and I didn't read most of the topic lol. But from my experiences in other forums, the most "transparent" way to pick moderators is with a poll where every player can vote for any candidate. I'm not sure if this forum's plataform could allow It. Let me try an example:

 

Thread #1 By Oda/Campitor

 

Now the season to be candidate for VMod is up (could be idk, 3 days for time limit?)

 

People who wanted to be mod (at the end of the thread)

 

-Potato-Kun

-Avocado-Senpai

-Nasty-Pear

-sh!tposting

-sh!tposting

-Banana-Sama

-sh!tposting

-sh!tposting

-sh!tposting

-Milky-Cow

-sh!tposting

 

After the event period, a Thread with a poll could be created with only the people that wanted to be a VMod (TEMPORAL mod). If It's not possible, a GM could make a Thread with X posts (in this example 5 candidates) with 1 different name each (1 post = 1 candidate) locked and pinned and every member on forums can upvote a post. (since you can see who upvoted wich post). Only people with idk, 100 posts or 2 months can be considered a valid vote, and one person voting twice or more won't be considered either.

 

tl:dr

 

Let us decide who deserves to be a VMod, It will make it way easier for everyone, because we know who's helpful and who's just an useless troll

 

 

Milky Cow.... 

 

Edited by MilkyThief, 06 April 2015 - 08:11 PM.

[ChakriGuard]

Bias and Power hunger to abuse is part of human being.

I find it acceptable and that I dont really care much, although I am happy to see some people care enough to try to make things right or make right things? (Whichever is correct lol)

[schia]

i hate everyone equally, does that make me a good candidate to be a volunteer mod?

[Kuroyukiii]

HEY

 

Spoiler

I hope this game just die, slowly in pain, engulfed into abyssal darkness instead of played by grown up retards from 10 years ago.

 

Spoiler

Nah, just kidding. I love the forum.

Edited by Kuroyukiii, 07 April 2015 - 05:36 AM.

[Alathea]

Sidenote, are there VMods that are monitoring the International section?

[6773131031232342973]

Sidenote, are there VMods that are monitoring the International section?

yes but they dont do their job btw

[ZeroTigress]

Sidenote, are there VMods that are monitoring the International section?

Not very actively. Those last 2 sections of the forums are pretty much no man's land when it comes to moderators.

[StormHaven]

Sidenote, are there VMods that are monitoring the International section?

There are for DS, not sure how often the other VMs check their international sections.

[Alathea]

Do those VMods get the same training as the other VMods? How come they're "not doing their jobs"? :/