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Guardian Items vs New Im gear.


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#26 StormHaven

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 08:15 AM

I really want them because they aren't soulbound.

I really hate how most of the items that I want are 5k-10k+ and Heirloom. It is extremely disgruntling and I probably wouldn't have bothered with this game if I didn't have a lot of IM points from Ragnarok to begin with. The fact that so many items on this server are impossible to get in-game is annoying.

Current stuff should be on par with Heirloom stuff and if Heirloom stuff is OP, that stuff should be nerfed to current stuff. For Water/Fire that would mean making them Soulbound, lv1, and the same stats as Angel/Devil/Lucifer Set.

Pretty sure that would piss off a bunch of people tho so not happening.


heirloom stuff aside from Shaman/Pally Bone Dragon and Laloom shoulder's(and guardian too if you want to get all technical) are obsolete.

Edited by StormHaven, 13 August 2011 - 08:15 AM.

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#27 Maronu

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 08:27 AM

Guardian set balancing is most affected at earlier levels, not so much near end game with the exception of the combination of amplification of stats and % set bonus buffs (Stacking high AGI and the AGI % set bonus) but that issue is being addressed as Endy has pointed out.

Redacting of established items is, in my opinion, not the route WarpPortal should continue to follow.

What does everyone think about WarpPortal re-releasing the items as cash card or energy transfer bonuses? Perhaps for $50 and up cards this time around.


Sounds alright, but I'm still somewhat of the opinion that cash sets should be unique appearance items and players should look different. That being said, I would rather Gravity released something with the same stats instead of the old guardian sets (some players paid a lot of gold for the old guardian sets and I think they deserve to at least be able to have something slightly unique). Perhaps the bonus rewards could even be something as simple as an earth and wind set (different colors but same stats). If the guardian stats aren't breaking the game, I really wouldn't mind if all the unique sets on the mixboard got a buff so that they provided the same stats and were tradeable. Why do bonus sets have to be better than mixboard sets? I'd like to have different fashion sets to choose from that are functional stat wise. I'd definitely get some special sets if they could be equipped and still keep their value.

Release a fire guardian weapon with the same stats as water weapon and have other equal weapons that we can get from events (xmas weapons perhaps). If having items with a different appearance is too much, at least add heirloom to the names of the old equips or something. Some players like their rare items.

Edited by Maronu, 13 August 2011 - 08:30 AM.

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#28 MicoJive

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 08:58 AM

+1
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#29 Ethernal

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 09:13 AM

I really want them because they aren't soulbound.

I really hate how most of the items that I want are 5k-10k+ and Heirloom. It is extremely disgruntling and I probably wouldn't have bothered with this game if I didn't have a lot of IM points from Ragnarok to begin with. The fact that so many items on this server are impossible to get in-game is annoying.

Current stuff should be on par with Heirloom stuff and if Heirloom stuff is OP, that stuff should be nerfed to current stuff. For Water/Fire that would mean making them Soulbound, lv1, and the same stats as Angel/Devil/Lucifer Set.

Pretty sure that would piss off a bunch of people tho so not happening.

lucifer set? -_-
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#30 StormHaven

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 09:31 AM

lucifer set? -_-


Has far as i know there is no lucifer set. Might be talking about paris tho.
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#31 Miname

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 01:12 PM

That's certainly an idea, but all I wanted to express is re-releasing items in a fair, but slightly difficult to obtain is preffered imo than nerfing existing items.

That said, I do not feel that raffles for these particular old items are the best route in terms of balancing which is why I suggested automatically receiving the set with a higher than "normal" cash purchase.
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#32 Rimmy

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 01:26 PM

We got the guardian set as a bonus when we bought a gamecard from THQ. It didn't have uber stats on it before.


First off, what Maronu said is completely true. And if WP had nerfed the Guardian sets right from the get-go, that would have been perfectly fine. The problem stems from the fact that, because the Guardian sets' bonuses were allowed to remain in game for this long, there are many players who have poured thousands and thousands of gold into purchasing and/or upgrading these items. Nerfing them now would mean a significant loss on those investments.

Having said that -- I, personally, see nothing wrong with nerfing all IM items to level 1 items, as Endbringer and Yurai suggested, so long as the stats default to maximum to at least somewhat preserve players' investments in these sets.

But like Storm said, the real problem isn't the soulcrafted options, it's the bonus stats (the PDD/MDD and the extra health/agility, in particular). I'm not sure how you can nerf or remove those stats without it being unfair (considering the investments mentioned above), but I do believe that releasing a new, comparable set (or multiple sets) would be fair and help address the issue.
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#33 StormHaven

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 01:38 PM

Honestly i think WP should just Soul Bind the Guardian Gear and make it unable to Soul Craft. Then make all new IM gear not soul bind and raise it up to 20. That'll make guardian less pleasing for people and promote getting the newer IM fashions.

Edited by StormHaven, 14 August 2011 - 01:49 PM.

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#34 MicoJive

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 03:23 PM

Just making the items sb doesnt change the fact they are FAR superior to what currently is available for im.
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#35 Jumpluffspore

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 03:51 PM

Just making the items sb doesnt change the fact they are FAR superior to what currently is available for im.

It helps. You seem to underestimate the power of small steps.
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#36 MicoJive

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 06:29 PM

...but it really doesnt help. For one it limits people from actually BUYING the set, so people that do not have it already are screwed out of ever getting it. 2nd...the set still adds 100+ eva to agi based classes and atleast 70 to non agi classes compared to...10 maybe with new set.
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#37 Ethernal

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 06:50 PM

...but it really doesnt help. For one it limits people from actually BUYING the set, so people that do not have it already are screwed out of ever getting it. 2nd...the set still adds 100+ eva to agi based classes and atleast 70 to non agi classes compared to...10 maybe with new set.

wtf? guardian doesn't give me 70 eva..

Edited by Ethernal, 14 August 2011 - 06:50 PM.

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#38 Endbringer

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 06:58 PM

wtf? guardian doesn't give me 70 eva..


He's just over exaggerating to make it seem like a bigger deal than it is.
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#39 GrapefruitGod

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 07:00 PM

Considering I have 98 evade (and am a sentinel), I beg to differ
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#40 Ethernal

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 07:06 PM

Considering I have 98 evade (and am a sentinel), I beg to differ

guardian gives me like what? 10 eva? 20? lawl not that great
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#41 MicoJive

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Posted 14 August 2011 - 07:34 PM

are you all retarded? my pally goes from 22 eva up to 78 with guardian, and my 45 nin goes from 30 up to 8x. Buddys lvl 45 pally has 9x and his nin gains over 100.
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#42 Astronix

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 04:47 AM

Nerfing/Removing/Soul bound is not fair for those who farmed for days to get those set pieces... Like me
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#43 StormHaven

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 04:51 AM

Nerfing/Removing/Soul bound is not fair for those who farmed for days to get those set pieces... Like me

guardian was untradeable before Gravity.
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#44 Yurai

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 08:25 AM

guardian was untradeable before Gravity.


But everything was untradeable before Gravity. I don't think making pieces soulbound would benefit anyone. The players who already have the pieces would still have them and the people who are saving up to buy their full set would be upset that they didn't get to buy the entire set.

Edited by Yurai, 15 August 2011 - 08:26 AM.

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#45 StormHaven

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 08:31 AM

But everything was untradeable before Gravity. I don't think making pieces soulbound would benefit anyone. The players who already have the pieces would still have them and the people who are saving up to buy their full set would be upset that they didn't get to buy the entire set.


the only options i can think of them are removing all the SC options and make them un SC able or turning them down to lvl 1 and adjust the options accordingly.
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#46 Himeyasha

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 10:15 AM

Lucifer set is the 3rd IM special set that comes with wings (same number of pieces and similar stats to Angel/Devil) it's on Russia's Dragonica and Thai (looks like this male female

Edited by Himeyasha, 15 August 2011 - 10:24 AM.

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#47 StormHaven

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 10:35 AM

Lucifer set is the 3rd IM special set that comes with wings (same number of pieces and similar stats to Angel/Devil) it's on Russia's Dragonica and Thai (looks like this male female


I WANT THAT SET. besides the helm.
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#48 Ethernal

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 11:08 AM

are you all retarded? my pally goes from 22 eva up to 78 with guardian, and my 45 nin goes from 30 up to 8x. Buddys lvl 45 pally has 9x and his nin gains over 100.

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#49 Rimmy

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 11:14 AM

I believe the reason that some are seeing a massive evade increase while others are not is because of the Agility score involved. A high Agility will lead to massive evade boosts from Evade Rate %, while a low Agility will mean meager increases. That's probably why your increases are so unimpressive, Ethernal -- the others posting are probably talking about characters with high Agility, while you're showing the effects without taking Agility from other equips into account.

But back on topic, I still think that the best way to handle this is to release new sets that are identical to or comparable to the Guardian sets. Preferably, I'd kinda go along with Maronu's suggestion to make (at least most) cash items have identical bonuses so that players are encouraged to have diverse appearances. Currently, the obsession with Guardian equips kinda limits that creativity.
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#50 Ethernal

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 11:17 AM

I believe the reason that some are seeing a massive evade increase while others are not is because of the Agility score involved. A high Agility will lead to massive evade boosts from Evade Rate %, while a low Agility will mean meager increases. That's probably why your increases are so unimpressive, Ethernal -- the others posting are probably talking about characters with high Agility, while you're showing the effects without taking Agility from other equips into account.

But back on topic, I still think that the best way to handle this is to release new sets that are identical to or comparable to the Guardian sets. Preferably, I'd kinda go along with Maronu's suggestion to make (at least most) cash items have identical bonuses so that players are encouraged to have diverse appearances. Currently, the obsession with Guardian equips kinda limits that creativity.

yeah, i thought about the agi thingy, but my point was that not EVERYONE gets a super eva boost, like that idiot, and that non-agi based classes can only get 20-30 evade, which is not that significant

on the other point, i agree with you in making the new/future im sets comparable with guardian!
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