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#76 Mefistofeles

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 11:32 PM

I wanna be able to fight with my tropical outfit on.

murdering noobs with my santa costume XD
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#77 Zinja

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 11:38 PM

murdering noobs with my santa costume XD

I don't think that would work because Santa costume is temporary buff for short duration. It disables any skills casting or attack mode. It is not some gear per-se.
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#78 Uruwashii

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 03:32 AM

disappointed sfghsdfh
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#79 Akami

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:51 AM

murdering noobs with my santa costume XD

Turn WoE into The Night Santa Went Crazy
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#80 Codface

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 05:40 AM

Rubbish feature if special costume only items. Will mean in future.

Less variety
less new useful headgears
reissue of old hg as costumes
basically gonna annoy everyone with a shark hat, tongue, beer hat or anything else stat useless but cute
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#81 Chigikogou

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 02:58 PM

No, I am sure we will have more weather headgears + adding catastrophic ones.

Tsunami headgear
Solar Flare headgear
Lunar and Solar Eclipse headgear
Tornade headgear

Yeah yeah yeah how awesome costumes are~
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#82 Heimdallr

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 03:43 PM

Part of the testing of the Costume tab was to figure out what limitations there were on it.

Looking at the back end stuff the costume tab stuff all have seperate locations, so an item that is allowed to go on costume tab Top Headgear might be location 11 where normal top headgear might be location 1. There is no cross over between them.

And yes the costume tab is for giving a separate look that what is standard, BUT I think it will be easy to request costume versions of most every headgear in the game, so that you can do whatever look you want. There will be kafra shop stuff, but there will also be event related ones and I'm hoping that later we can do some trade in stuff to get your costume tab looks.



We are looking into the other bugs like the MVP error and PVP. Those certainly are show stoppers for this update.
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#83 Rutana

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 03:51 PM

It's nice to hear that you're working on this, Heim, even if it's taking longer...
But could it be possible that rare Headgears can stay rare? And that persons who aquired them could get them easier?
Don't get me wrong, I have no problem to see more people with the Heart Ribbon Hairband for example, but I would be kinda sad if the costume version is so hard to get, that I may have problems achieving one even though I allready have it. Some Headgears are loved for their rarity - and I think other players share this thought.
Especially for Headgears that only have a style reason AND are rare... because the main versions would loose their value pretty fast, since the costume version of style gears is better... :/
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#84 Beyond

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:01 PM

Part of the testing of the Costume tab was to figure out what limitations there were on it.

Looking at the back end stuff the costume tab stuff all have seperate locations, so an item that is allowed to go on costume tab Top Headgear might be location 11 where normal top headgear might be location 1. There is no cross over between them.

And yes the costume tab is for giving a separate look that what is standard, BUT I think it will be easy to request costume versions of most every headgear in the game, so that you can do whatever look you want. There will be kafra shop stuff, but there will also be event related ones and I'm hoping that later we can do some trade in stuff to get your costume tab looks.


Make it so Number 2 :mellow:

@Rutana- That's why I liked the Costume Coupon idea. It would prevent Rare headgears from being visually common. At the very least with your original idea, I would like to see both the headgear and the Costume version become account bound during it's 7/30/perm duration(that way they can still use the stats/cards if needed) and maybe add an extra Return to Item Coupon for the Perm items that would return it to it's original Headgear cause after like a year you just may get bored of it. If the original headgear was not account bound, it could easily be switched between users and continuously be replicated as a costume item.
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#85 Rutana

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:14 PM

The problem I see with it is that you would have to replace the headgear with a copy version of it that is account bound. I'm very sure, that you can't put single headgears account bound - it's only all of that kind (like all St Patricks Hat) or none.
And when you have an NPC replacing it with an Account Bound version, you will loose cards and upgrades attached to it...

I'm thinking over and over to find a solution for it, and honestly... the best one coming into my mind to it would be to take every headgear with a specific value out of rarity and style (like Heart Ribbon Hairband, that's only aviable in a limited number) and copy it in the exact same amount, giving the owners the copy for free. Those owners could do as they please with original and costume version - it would still be rare. Also, if there are rare ones that can be still made or found (Kafra Band for example, allthough it could be I overestimate the value because it was so terrible rare at euRO XD), you could just add the costume version of it as well. I would love this for quests/mixing headgears as well! Or in this case, giving the choose if you wanna have the normal or the costume version of it.

Not so rare ones but still "unique" or valueable (St Patricks Hat, Rideword Hat, Dress Hat etc) could be turn out as Kafra Shop or Lucky Box items, but easier to get than the normal version (since the normal version would be the ones with higher value thanks to the stats)

...don't know... ._.
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#86 allastorm

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:18 PM

I agree with the rareity of some headgears. I know I have a few in my collection that I have spent quite a bit of zeny on, and if people can all of a sudden purchase any headgear that they want as a costume... it takes away the value of the headgears in game right now! That is just NOT fair. I think that costume headgears that are the same as current in-game headgears should ONLY be obtainable by those who already possess the headgear, and somehow make it accound bound (to prevent people from exploiting it, of course).

Maybe just make an NPC that can make a duplciate of your headgear (so you must have it in your inventory) that is character bound, can NOT be traded, placed in storage or anything, and when you are done with it you "sell" it back to the NPC. In the meantime, maybe the NPC could hold on to the actual headgear item as collateral so to speak, and once you trade back your costume, you can recieve your original headgear back. You could even slap a zeny fee on this if you wanted. I dunno, I think that could work. If you have something pointless but awesome and you want it as a costume, trade it to make it a costume item, and trade it back in the future if you want to use its effects.
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#87 Akami

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:23 PM

I like the idea of costume headgears of anything. There's too many powerful headgears that look ugly as hell, likewise too many awesome looking ones that aren't worth jack.
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#88 Rutana

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:28 PM

Maybe just make an NPC that can make a duplciate of your headgear (so you must have it in your inventory) that is character bound, can NOT be traded, placed in storage or anything, and when you are done with it you "sell" it back to the NPC. In the meantime, maybe the NPC could hold on to the actual headgear item as collateral so to speak, and once you trade back your costume, you can recieve your original headgear back. You could even slap a zeny fee on this if you wanted. I dunno, I think that could work. If you have something pointless but awesome and you want it as a costume, trade it to make it a costume item, and trade it back in the future if you want to use its effects.


That's the problem about it - it shouldn't be possible.
I always wondererd a bit about some mechanics in the game, like why you loose the upgrade of an equipment if you slot it - and why you loose enchantments when you slot it.
The reason is, that upgrades and cards aren't part of the item id and the NPC's can only recognize this id's and handle out this id's. They would need to add EVERY Headgear in EVERY Upgrade Status and with EVERY Card combination to provide a safe "holding" function.

It's just a guess though, but I think it's very accurate.
That's why I said copy the rare ones and give one copy for each headgear to those players who're owning it right now - so it would be the exact same amount of costume items like normal items and those players who achieved the rare headgears would have it.

I mean, I would love to have a Toucan Hat or an Hat of Solar Sungod as Costume Item as well, but I think it's just not fair to those who're owning them, if they're that easy aviable...
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#89 Beyond

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:28 PM

The problem I see with it is that you would have to replace the headgear with a copy version of it that is account bound. I'm very sure, that you can't put single headgears account bound - it's only all of that kind (like all St Patricks Hat) or none.
And when you have an NPC replacing it with an Account Bound version, you will loose cards and upgrades attached to it...

I'm thinking over and over to find a solution for it, and honestly... the best one coming into my mind to it would be to take every headgear with a specific value out of rarity and style (like Heart Ribbon Hairband, that's only aviable in a limited number) and copy it in the exact same amount, giving the owners the copy for free. Those owners could do as they please with original and costume version - it would still be rare. Also, if there are rare ones that can be still made or found (Kafra Band for example, allthough it could be I overestimate the value because it was so terrible rare at euRO XD), you could just add the costume version of it as well. I would love this for quests/mixing headgears as well! Or in this case, giving the choose if you wanna have the normal or the costume version of it.

Not so rare ones but still "unique" or valueable (St Patricks Hat, Rideword Hat, Dress Hat etc) could be turn out as Kafra Shop or Lucky Box items, but easier to get than the normal version (since the normal version would be the ones with higher value thanks to the stats)

...don't know... ._.


I can see your point. With no systems knowledge we can only "guesstimate" on what can be done.

Well waking what we got from Heim's post we know that the normal Headgear slot would be location 1 and the Costume Headgear would be location 11. It would simply be allowing Headgears to be able to go to both locations(Which I do hope would be an easy request).

Taking this into account. I think a good solution might be a Costume Unlock item in the Kafra Shop that would unlock normal headgears into the Costume Tab but make the stats/cards void while slotted in Costume Tab.

Edited by Beyond, 07 November 2011 - 04:29 PM.

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#90 Rutana

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:32 PM

I don't know if this would be so easily possible, Beyond, it may take heavy scripting... and kRO may not be very happy about it.
I think, if it would be that easy, Heim wouldn't consider to make copies of headgears - since this would be a LOT more work, seeing of how many Headgears there are...
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#91 allastorm

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:49 PM

Im not saying it would be easy, and you bring up a good point about different carded hats being different hats. That would be an immense amount of coding. It was just an idea. Apparently copies is just making things overcomplicated XD

Ultimately, what would be awesome is if all the current headgears could be modified to be this location 1 and location 11 that was mentioned, so that if you have the headgear, you can wear it as you wish as costume or equip. Then, if you sell the headgear to someone else in the future, they can do as they choose as well. I dont see why THIS would be difficult to do... I think its more if they WANT to let us have these options, or make us buy with KP...
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#92 Beyond

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 04:53 PM

I don't know if this would be so easily possible, Beyond, it may take heavy scripting... and kRO may not be very happy about it.
I think, if it would be that easy, Heim wouldn't consider to make copies of headgears - since this would be a LOT more work, seeing of how many Headgears there are...


It comes down to how they will release them into the game too, which is unpredictable. You're right, there are a lot of headgears. Just handing them out would ruin it. Creating an extra Kafra NPC with all the headgears would do the same. Giving everyone who owns one doesn't help because what if Player A would sell said headgear to player B and now Player B wants the Costume Version and if he get's it, then sells the headgear to Player C, etc. destroying the visual rarity of the headgear

If they do them via Lucky Box/Season/whatever, it may also take months or even years before they reach the Costume Version that a player would want to purchase. With Lucky Boxes, they may only go with those that are rare or favorites which would also make them common in the eyes of the community(throw a Hat of a Sun God Costume Version in a Lucky Box would probably increase sales but destroy the rareness). Like my Shadow Chaser who always wears Goggles. How long till they reach something that common?
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#93 morphine

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 05:16 PM

From what I read here, I think the most appealing option would be to just create an NPC that will give a player the option to copy a real headgear in their inventory for an account-bound costume version that expires after 30 days or something. Rare headgears would stay rare and somewhat useful to create or buy in game at least. Hell, I wouldn't mind if they consumed a Kafra Shop item in order to make the copy (as long as it was tradable/vendable). It would be better than selling hats in the shop outright. For extra work fun, you could make the costume version available in different colours... *cough* >.> There are indeed a TON of hats in the game, but keeping the list to things that are cute and useless should shorten it quite a bit. (If you have trouble telling what is "cute", run a survey or something... XD Please no censor bars.) It would be nice if special promotional hats could be included too, since it would be a lovely gesture to people who supported things, letting them show the gear off more often.
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#94 Heimdallr

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 05:24 PM

I do not know if this is true.. but I know the intention was to give diversity in appearance and to keep values of gears high.

IF we did a trade in to swap a regular for a costume version it would at the very least require 1 of the normal headgear and transform it (stripping upgrades/cards) so it can go into the costume tab. So things like Heart Ribbon Hairband and Solar Sun God helm aren't impacted in rarity due to this change. And as much as I really don't want to be a prick about business I do have to say that the costume system is also about regaining interest in the Kafra shop, so there will be gears in there for that.

I think looking at the various gears and card combination I would be concerned about the amount of stacking for sets and item drops that could be done if carded items both were allowed and worked in the costume tabs, the way it is now it isn't a concern because none of those gears can be put in the costume.
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#95 Chigikogou

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 05:30 PM

Though in any means I am fine if it does go that way.
But I wanted to have a costume that shows no headgear. I hate putting sunlight on my head.
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#96 Beyond

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 05:41 PM

I do not know if this is true.. but I know the intention was to give diversity in appearance and to keep values of gears high.

IF we did a trade in to swap a regular for a costume version it would at the very least require 1 of the normal headgear and transform it (stripping upgrades/cards) so it can go into the costume tab. So things like Heart Ribbon Hairband and Solar Sun God helm aren't impacted in rarity due to this change. And as much as I really don't want to be a prick about business I do have to say that the costume system is also about regaining interest in the Kafra shop, so there will be gears in there for that.

I think looking at the various gears and card combination I would be concerned about the amount of stacking for sets and item drops that could be done if carded items both were allowed and worked in the costume tabs, the way it is now it isn't a concern because none of those gears can be put in the costume.


I can understand the option to lose the headgear as it would create a "Item Sink" and may actually increase the rarity, but from a players perspective I would hate to lose the item/cards permanently.

Edit: But then again, What people really want to wear, they probably wouldn't care if it destroyed the item as they wore it for other reasons. At least I wouldn't mind having some of my items "sinked", if it meant I could wear them forever.

Edited by Beyond, 07 November 2011 - 05:50 PM.

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#97 Heimdallr

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:09 PM

Most of the fun looking items often don't have cool stats anyway.

Any sort of tradein will take a while to implement as we need to not only get the items created but we also need to carefully balance how the acquirement works. I am certain that when we launch the costume system it will be with a few headgear options in the Kafra shop, by necessity they probably will be account bound.
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#98 Rutana

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:26 PM

Giving everyone who owns one doesn't help because what if Player A would sell said headgear to player B and now Player B wants the Costume Version and if he get's it, then sells the headgear to Player C, etc. destroying the visual rarity of the headgear


Not if this happens only ONCE.
Like - when you have the costume copy of an rare headgear aviable, give it to everyone who owns it in this moment (but make it tradeable) and don't give it out a second time. This would keep the rarity high.


And as much as I really don't want to be a prick about business I do have to say that the costume system is also about regaining interest in the Kafra shop, so there will be gears in there for that.


That's totally fine, if it aren't rare headgears. Many seem to love Shark Hat and Hohoue Mask - so these would be a great sell.


Personally, I would hate to loose the originals, because for me the original still has a special value. It's fine for not-so-rare headgears like Kafra Band, but the real rare ones? It would be a pitty...
Also, some may find usefull headgears pretty as well, like Rideword Hat, but that they wanna wear it on characters that don't have any usage of it.


And on a sidenote - it would be awesome if the costume items don't have a restriction of class or level... wearing a costume Spikey Band on a Mage Cls? Why not? :3
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#99 allastorm

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:38 PM

I do not know if this is true.. but I know the intention was to give diversity in appearance and to keep values of gears high.

IF we did a trade in to swap a regular for a costume version it would at the very least require 1 of the normal headgear and transform it (stripping upgrades/cards) so it can go into the costume tab. So things like Heart Ribbon Hairband and Solar Sun God helm aren't impacted in rarity due to this change. And as much as I really don't want to be a prick about business I do have to say that the costume system is also about regaining interest in the Kafra shop, so there will be gears in there for that.

I think looking at the various gears and card combination I would be concerned about the amount of stacking for sets and item drops that could be done if carded items both were allowed and worked in the costume tabs, the way it is now it isn't a concern because none of those gears can be put in the costume.


I think that would be fair, to trade in the headgear for the costume version of it. I can understand that cards makes everything complicated, but to be honest if someone had a carded headgear they probably plan on using it for stat purposes anyways. My only concern is that we should have the option to return the headgear back from costume to a regular equip using a reverse process. I dont think you should be able to vend or trade costume headgears, but if we have the process to turn them back into regular equips, they should be able to be sold again as per usual.

Anyways, I hope this is something that will happen in the future, because the costume tab idea really is great and would make so much more variety for characters if we could use the headgears we currently own. Like I said a few pages back... nothing wrong at all with selling NEW headgears in the kafra shop, in fact I encourage it. I just dont think that previous headgears should be easily aquired as costumes unless we already own them.

Thanks for responding to this thread, Heim. Glad to know at least someone is hearing what we have to say. Hopefully something good will come from it all in the end :mellow:
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