100 replies to this topic

[Leinzan]

uhm, build wont open to me, something about hosting sites in portuguese...

MD is risky as is, pretty much is another utility skill rather than plain offensive.

If we grab the opinion of all the Rogue community we could pretty much do a book about the pros and cons of this skill.

 

Whatever you choose in the end is what you feel more comfy with, because thats your playstyle >=P

 

The strongest skills are the player skills

[ZT0100]

I think I'll just get a respec scroll at 50 and go full PVP. That's what I wanted to do from the start anyway but then I guess I read too many people's opinions.

 

How about you test the build you currently have and respec when you're 100% of your play-style? I am currently making a new rogue and I am still unsure of what to put points into.. I play Colo everyday on my lvl 50 rogue to get an idea. So far I am thinking of leaving DP at 1 because I don't use my DIs fast enough. As for points into CM, you might also want to test it out in Colo. I honestly don't use it all that much.. like 1-2 times per round. The combo Lein mentioned with MD is worth considering.

[3305130708053819460]

I think I got a good idea now as to how I want to play my Rogue. Ofc I'll wait till I'm 100% sure before I respec but you guys are right, my build is pretty much all over the place right now. I'll drop poison completely since I don't really rebuff myself during the rounds anyway except for UD when I'm visible and trying to stick to the walls. My playstyle is pretty much: wait for lowhp -> ks -> smoke bomb. and if I find an isolated sorc or ranger I'll just try my best in a 1v1. 

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ro2base has host problems at the moment. :S I just noticed that, thus the portuguese message. to sum it up: I leave MD and CM at 1 (cause I don't use it more than every 60s anyway) and get my buffs / utility skills to 5/5. This way I still got all my skills and I don't think that the dmg output from MD changes that much from lvl 1 to lvl whatever because it's not flat but single hits over time. 

 

By the way. If I have max DP, is it worth using it to get a max duration stun off? 

[3305130708053819460]

-nvm this post, forum kinda posted my post twice- :S

Edited by 3305130708053819460, 12 August 2013 - 02:24 PM.

[Leinzan]

 

By the way. If I have max DP, is it worth using it to get a max duration stun off?

yup, thats pretty much the Rogue ultimate combo, VERY HARD TO DO, but also VERY HARD TO SURVIVE TO... I've done up to triple kills by using it!!

 

here goes:

Hiding, maxed AR, all buffs and all...

 

DT, DI, SB, DI, play with DS & DA (use DB {NOT MD} only if CoM procs), CM, DP, Smash with DA ONLY, CM, Keep smashing with DA & DS (Use DB if CoM procs), DB or MD, SB, DI. <- see what survives that if they cant interrupt you...

[ZT0100]

yup, thats pretty much the Rogue ultimate combo, VERY HARD TO DO, but also VERY HARD TO SURVIVE TO... I've done up to triple kills by using it!!

 

here goes:

Hiding, maxed AR, all buffs and all...

 

DT, DI, SB, DI, play with DS & DA (use DB {NOT MD} only if CoM procs), CM, DP, Smash with DA ONLY, CM, Keep smashing with DA & DS (Use DB if CoM procs), DB or MD, SB, DI. <- see what survives that if they cant interrupt you...

 

 

You said a mouthful there! NO WAY IN HELL!!!!!!! NO!

 

Practically, you can get 2-3 hits off with DP stun. The double stun is not worth it. When you used DP, you could be doing an extra 2 hits instead. So yeah, you don't accomplish much with a double stun.

 

DP is mainly for GP and SB. 'Nuff said!

Edited by ZT0100, 12 August 2013 - 03:18 PM.

[Leinzan]

XD

yea, looks crazy, but hey, tripple kills in a room~! (yea, its crazy)

 

also, double stun is one of the only ways you'll ever be able to kill healing specialist sorcs O___o

well, this comes from someone who likes to find strong ppl to waste time battling with XD (even if I get kicked out because of that)

 

not that I've ever had the chance to do the FULL chain, tho...

[ZT0100]

DT, DI, SB, DI, play with DS & DA (use DB {NOT MD} only if CoM procs), CM, DP, Smash with DA ONLY, CM, Keep smashing with DA & DS (Use DB if CoM procs), DB or MD, SB, DI.

 

[Leinzan]

I did that on a sorc just now... well... half of it...

I should have recorded it but fraps is annoying on early rounds .___.

 

then he killed me at last seconds of that round... SO I KILLED HIM 3 TIMES IN THE NEXT ONE AND GOT HIM KICKED OUT!!!!

 

oh well life is fun

[mysticalre]

remove my quote from this thread, i want no party of this

[3305130708053819460]

 

lol (yes pls gimme that hammer against all those annyoing rangers out there haha)

[Shinyuki]

How do you guys deal w/ the aoe dot pets that knock u out of stealth?

[Leinzan]

try to be on clearer areas, dont cross on top of players, AoE reveals you, no matter what

[Shinyuki]

Since my rogue only has 8.8k hp in colo, it's been pretty bad. Super juicy target for sure.

Before I would hide and stalk a target to DI, and try to KS them in the fray, and SB out then repeat.

Since pets came in, even if you miss the KS and get teleported in on your DI, and there's a pet in the vicinity you have a chance to get aoe dot'd for the 30s.

Worst is when you use DI don't get the credit for the KS, use SB, then get an aoe dot applied.

 

What pets are you guys using in colo?  

 

[ZT0100]

Since my rogue only has 8.8k hp in colo, it's been pretty bad. Super juicy target for sure.

Before I would hide and stalk a target to DI, and try to KS them in the fray, and SB out then repeat.

Since pets came in, even if you miss the KS and get teleported in on your DI, and there's a pet in the vicinity you have a chance to get aoe dot'd for the 30s.

Worst is when you use DI don't get the credit for the KS, use SB, then get an aoe dot applied.

 

What pets are you guys using in colo?  

 

Rogues are super squishy and slow meleers. You might have to jump into the fray once you've used DI because of an AoE/DoT, or you can run off somewhere safe. You probably won't survive fighting people, but try to score some points. GP and master red potions might help you live until the DoT effect wears off.  If you do die, respawn and then set up for your next DI. No biggie. The most important thing is that you KS a valuable target near the end and get ranked enough to advance, so don't give up.

Edited by ZT0100, 14 August 2013 - 12:31 PM.

[xxalucard]

What pets are you guys using in colo?  

 

Executer Undead.   Amazing AoE stun (like a mini eremes) for ks's and getaways.

 

 

The mermaid AoE is annoying as hell.  If you see a kill you really want, you're just gonna have to weigh whether or not you want to eat the dot while you see the mermaid out-- unfortunately this game was poorly made without a dodge button, so nothing else you can really do about it.

 

 

 

Also

 

Moonlight Dance:  The answer to sliding bodies on the floor

Edited by xxalucard, 15 August 2013 - 12:32 AM.

[Leinzan]

Moonlight Dance:  The answer to sliding bodies on the floor

can't discuss that

 

BTW, a good skill for chasing if you are on like 3~5m away from target on the run is Rolling Cutter or Meteor Assault, rolling cutter is better tho (yup, be doutful as you may).

Edited by Leinzan, 15 August 2013 - 06:38 AM.

[idpetey]

 

Moonlight Dance:  The answer to sliding bodies on the floor

 

I shot off a Moonlight Dance just before I died on a ranger who was also about to die- he killed me then my MD finished and killed him after I died and I got the kill!! BAHAHAHA

[ZT0100]

Wind elixir: The answer to almost everything.

[Leinzan]

My turn to do a respec,

MD is simply lovely~♥ as much it has betrayed me, I really miss it

Besides MoG is hardly notorious, and I gotta say I simply dont need it (gonna have more crit than anyone in raid with or without it anyway)

 

Odd enough, Im keeping Rolling Cutter, that skill touched a soft spot in my heart (and has earned me 3 kills in colo so far)

[ZT0100]

Yeah, MD is a good skill to have. I was considering what you said about it being a "deadly flaw", but I maxed it on my new rogue anyway and killed 3 ppl with it in Colo today. Would be 4 kills with it, but I got gangbanged to death before the last few hits connect. Can't wait for the bug to be fixed and have it at its full power!

 

But you know, MoG is kinda irreplaceable, despite what I thought of it in the past. You will always be a rouge with 1.6% crit less than rogues that maxed it if you are 1/5. Every crit % counts, IMO.

[Leinzan]

haaah I wish in colo all skills were avilable and maxed...

[3305130708053819460]

@ZT0100

 

so now that you maxed MD on your new Rogue, how big is the difference between 1/5 and 5/5 damage wise? (or also between the latter levels: 3/5 -> 5/5)

I got my MD on 2/5 at the moment and I didn't really notice any difference compared to 1/5. 

[ZT0100]

To give you some ideas... Well, I used MD during training, but I left it at 1/5 until I reached lvl 40ish to max it. I was testing to see if the damage throughout the MD animation was more than my single critical 1/ 5 DB. The total damage of MD throughout the 3 seconds was better than my fully charged, critical hit 1/5 DB( though, it was not very noticeable.) So my fully charged DB was at 52%, and crit to 104%. MD was only 84%, but the total damage during the animation dealt more( due to poison, some critical hits of MD, and the auto attacks). What I am trying to say is a single critical hit DB at 1/5 deals almost as much damage as the total damage of MD during the whole 3 secs animation.

 

Now after having maxed MD, it seems to be doing like almost double damage of the DB at 1/5. If I remember correctly, as of now my poorly geared rogue does around 300 for a non critical DB, and 600 when it crits. Most of the times, my MD at maxed level does about 1000 in total( including the poison and autoattacks.)

 

So from my observations, what I am trying to conclude is that a maxed MD is clearly stronger( almost twice as stronger) than a single, charged, critical hit DB. I believe it appears to be almost twice as strong because of the autoattacks, some critical hits, and poison during the animations.

 

BUT if you want real math without factoring in the autoattack and poison hits:

 

110% / 84% = 1.30952380952, or about 31% more damage for maxing MD. 

 

For 3/5 MD, 97% / 84% = 1.15476190476, or 15% more damage.

 

I apologize if that is confusing. Basically, what I want to say is that MD is stronger than DB with only 1 skill used( this makes it effective as a finisher for those half-dead runners.) DB has the potential to deal more damage because it's faster and CM procs, but you need to use multiple skills to be stronger than a single MD( this can be a problem against runners.) So yeah, to answer your question, you get about 7.5% overall damage more for each level of MD. And yes, it is quite  noticeable, especially in comparison to the damage of my single DB critical hit, after having it maxed. 

 

BUT THEN AGAIN, MD is currently glitched with the final hit. The critical hit modifier isn't working properly. It probably will be even stronger when after they've fixed it.

 

Anyway, hopes that help!

 

Edited by ZT0100, 19 August 2013 - 02:27 PM.

[Leinzan]

Hmm this will be repetitive.

 

MD is composed of 9 strikes, first 4 happens in one second (amange occurs in less tho) then happen a normal attack and then the second set of 4, just for a finisher at the end after another normal strike.

 

Each one of the hits in the sets of 4 strikes is half the damange you do with 1 of the 2 strikes from a Double Attack.

this means that each set of 4 is a 25% damange, since there are 2 of those, the animation has dealt a 50% damange by the end of the 2nd second (weird enough).

 

This leaves the rest on the finisher, and since Im basing this on the 5/5 MD then the finisher should be of a 60%.

 

In other words, it is the same in time and damange than 1 max combo DB & 2 DAs.

 

What makes the diference, is the utility that once it connects it'll deal all damange to it's target without the need of running after it.

 

I don't recomend using it on targets above 3k hp or below 2k hp on colo (4k is a good mark if you aren't the only attacker on it).

And don't you dare use DB on targets below 1k hp.

 

This is considering MD and DB are on 5/5.