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#51 AkatsukiKawa

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 12:28 AM

100g per mercenary sounds good in my opinion.


Not all guild are that rich (especially new guild) and not every mercenary worth 100g. If by chance we have this kind of system in the future, it should at least depends on mercenary's level.
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#52 Rimmy

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 05:57 AM

The idea of paying for mercenaries makes sense, but as Akatsuki said, the weaker, low-level guilds might not be able to afford that and they're the ones that need mercs the most. That would also require new programming/coding, I believe, and I get the feeling it could be a long, long wait before something like that is implemented (if it would even get serious consideration, since it's basically one server requesting certain adjustments to EW for itself, alone -- the developers will probably always give preference to changes that will affect all servers).
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#53 Miname

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 08:46 AM

The idea of paying for mercenaries makes sense, but as Akatsuki said, the weaker, low-level guilds might not be able to afford that and they're the ones that need mercs the most. That would also require new programming/coding, I believe, and I get the feeling it could be a long, long wait before something like that is implemented (if it would even get serious consideration, since it's basically one server requesting certain adjustments to EW for itself, alone -- the developers will probably always give preference to changes that will affect all servers).

If a guild is so weak they cannot afford mercs, or cannot win with at least 50% of their own members, then they shouldn't be in Emporia in the first place.

Problems stemming from one or two guilds holding castle is just a byproduct of DS being a pay-to-win game. Fix that first, IMO. There's just way too big of a curve between the top and middle tiers of the playerbase at the moment.

Edited by Miname, 06 November 2011 - 08:52 AM.

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#54 Yurai

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Posted 06 November 2011 - 09:54 AM

Again, the mercenary system has brought us nothing but complaints and drama. Shouldn't there be some option to disable it for all guilds and keep it that way? I'm not saying to remove the mercenary system altogether, which would require a substantially larger effort, but disabling it on our server should be somehow possible.
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#55 samxslam

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Posted 13 December 2011 - 03:32 PM

still the strong guilds complain about EW not grouping together. All you have to do is have one guild join ew and alll yall merc for them simple!
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#56 ChifusaChan

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:04 AM

Why not make another bracket for small guilds and separate guilds by their guild level?
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#57 Coolsam

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:31 PM

Why not make another bracket for small guilds and separate guilds by their guild level?


Or by Average level. Make a separate EW tourney brackets based on Average level.

Like the Average levels must equal between certain ranges to be in that bracket and award different castles. Make Emporia based on certain level ranges like Battle Square.
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#58 StormHaven

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 05:35 PM

Or by Average level. Make a separate EW tourney brackets based on Average level.

Like the Average levels must equal between certain ranges to be in that bracket and award different castles. Make Emporia based on certain level ranges like Battle Square.


A level 60 is just as good as a lvl 80 in EW, it's all about how lucky you are at getting missions.

Why not make another bracket for small guilds and separate guilds by their guild level?

Most guilds that EW are 3-5(I think three lvl 3 guilds and 2 lvl 5 guilds that actually do EW) and there's really not enough guilds that actually do EW for this idea to work. Posted Image

Edited by StormHaven, 14 December 2011 - 05:40 PM.

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#59 Miname

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:03 PM

A level 60 is just as good as a lvl 80 in EW, it's all about how lucky you are at getting missions.


Most guilds that EW are 3-5(I think three lvl 3 guilds and 2 lvl 5 guilds that actually do EW) and there's really not enough guilds that actually do EW for this idea to work. Posted Image


Separate guild brackets may perhaps boost interest in EW among the lower level guilds.
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#60 StormHaven

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:22 PM

How would you separate it then, by how many times you've won in X amount of past tournaments?
edit: I'm all for finding a way to give more guilds incentive to do Emporia Wars

Edited by StormHaven, 14 December 2011 - 07:23 PM.

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#61 Miname

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:50 PM

How would you separate it then, by how many times you've won in X amount of past tournaments?
edit: I'm all for finding a way to give more guilds incentive to do Emporia Wars

There isn't really quite a clear-cut way that I can think of at the moment.
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#62 Rimmy

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 07:57 PM

I think if the rewards for participating were better, more guilds would participate even if they knew they were going to lose beyond a shadow of a doubt.

For instance, instead of offering players "temporary" cash items that give minor buffs, why not offer something more meaningful in the long-term, like they do for BSQ or Ranked PvP (enchantment dusts, souls, etc.)? I think if the amount given was decided carefully, it would be just enough to entice most players to get involved without making the item too plentiful.

Here's another idea regarding rewards: What if participating in EW earned you CP for Glorious sets, and the amount of CP you earned was related to how high your score was in EW? That would give extra incentive not just to enter the tournament, but to actually try to complete missions and earn as many points as possible, too.
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#63 Maronu

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Posted 14 December 2011 - 11:26 PM

I think if the rewards for participating were better, more guilds would participate even if they knew they were going to lose beyond a shadow of a doubt.

For instance, instead of offering players "temporary" cash items that give minor buffs, why not offer something more meaningful in the long-term, like they do for BSQ or Ranked PvP (enchantment dusts, souls, etc.)? I think if the amount given was decided carefully, it would be just enough to entice most players to get involved without making the item too plentiful.

Here's another idea regarding rewards: What if participating in EW earned you CP for Glorious sets, and the amount of CP you earned was related to how high your score was in EW? That would give extra incentive not just to enter the tournament, but to actually try to complete missions and earn as many points as possible, too.


It would make sense to give CP for kills, missions, and tournament wins. If this was added, CP could also be awarded for completing missions and killing people in BSQ (this is similiar to how WoW awards honor). I think an idea such as this would help fix the afk problem and give people a greater incentive to participate in large group pvp modes. Our "ranked battle system" is currently a joke, and should be replaced entirely with a system similar to the one you described.

As for the mercenary system, I also feel it should be disabled or removed entirely. EW should only be guild vs guild. It makes things much simpler, and there will be less drama that way.
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#64 Coolsam

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 08:23 AM

A level 60 is just as good as a lvl 80 in EW, it's all about how lucky you are at getting missions.


Most guilds that EW are 3-5(I think three lvl 3 guilds and 2 lvl 5 guilds that actually do EW) and there's really not enough guilds that actually do EW for this idea to work. Posted Image


Well when people think of Emporia, now they think of guilds fill of 70-80 players. A guild who's highest is only 1-3 people in that level range wouldn't try and fight a guild with 5-10 times that many people in that level range. But if they were in a bracket where the guild is full of players equal in level. It would give them the confidence to battle.

I think if the rewards for participating were better, more guilds would participate even if they knew they were going to lose beyond a shadow of a doubt.

For instance, instead of offering players "temporary" cash items that give minor buffs, why not offer something more meaningful in the long-term, like they do for BSQ or Ranked PvP (enchantment dusts, souls, etc.)? I think if the amount given was decided carefully, it would be just enough to entice most players to get involved without making the item too plentiful.

Here's another idea regarding rewards: What if participating in EW earned you CP for Glorious sets, and the amount of CP you earned was related to how high your score was in EW? That would give extra incentive not just to enter the tournament, but to actually try to complete missions and earn as many points as possible, too.


This could motivate more guilds. Especially now since ranked pvp is empty 80% of the time. And the other 20% is no one in your level range. This gives everyone a chance to earn CP for anything.
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#65 StormHaven

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 09:59 AM

Well when people think of Emporia, now they think of guilds fill of 70-80 players. A guild who's highest is only 1-3 people in that level range wouldn't try and fight a guild with 5-10 times that many people in that level range. But if they were in a bracket where the guild is full of players equal in level. It would give them the confidence to battle.


Regulars,Devils,Donuts,BT have less 80s than Asc,Empire,Rebellion,Improv, but they still do EW. When people think of Emporia they think of how many stacked players a guild has and then about the number of players.
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#66 AkatsukiKawa

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 11:29 AM

Rather than mercenary system, i think finding a way to have more participant is more important in current EW.

Rim's idea about rewarding the participant better is good. I just want to add 1 thing. The gold for bidding (minimum 100g) is too high for many guilds. And without good rewards, it is like join EW = waste of gold.

I think if it is lowered to like 10g or 1g, there will be more guild participating in EW.
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#67 StormHaven

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Posted 15 December 2011 - 11:57 AM

The gold for bidding (minimum 100g) is too high for many guilds. And without good rewards, it is like join EW = waste of gold.

I think if it is lowered to like 10g or 1g, there will be more guild participating in EW.



While this seems like a good idea at least 6 slots can be auto filled with 100g bids even with a lowered bidding and I'l bet people would still bid ~100g just to keep guilds who can't make that amount.
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#68 IreKire

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Posted 17 December 2011 - 10:50 AM

one thought, dunno if it was mentioned, only read page 3 so sorry :glomp:

I know for the top guilds they had issues with who becomes a merc, what about a pre-event merc system,
one that also lets guild leaders or vices choose to accept or reject mercs in advance ?
this may cut down on the previous complaints of alts from other guilds entering into a side they shouldnt.

on another note paid mercs seems like a good idea, price of 100g per isnt bad, maybe 1g per level ? could also make a merc board, like market place, where the mercs put up thier price for hire, but i would also say on the other end of that if they enter late or dont enter at all there should be adjustments or no pay.
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#69 Coolsam

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Posted 17 December 2011 - 10:55 AM

one thought, dunno if it was mentioned, only read page 3 so sorry :glomp:

I know for the top guilds they had issues with who becomes a merc, what about a pre-event merc system,
one that also lets guild leaders or vices choose to accept or reject mercs in advance ?
this may cut down on the previous complaints of alts from other guilds entering into a side they shouldnt.

on another note paid mercs seems like a good idea, price of 100g per isnt bad, maybe 1g per level ? could also make a merc board, like market place, where the mercs put up thier price for hire, but i would also say on the other end of that if they enter late or dont enter at all there should be adjustments or no pay.


We've discussed a gold for merc issue. But you've added more too it.

Merc's don't receive too many benefits tbh. The EW trophies and wings and nothing else. Perhaps the merc's can be given some more reward as well (Gold payment for their services or maybe even a free-trail of the castle.)

Edited by Coolsam, 17 December 2011 - 10:55 AM.

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#70 Miname

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Posted 17 December 2011 - 12:59 PM

We've discussed a gold for merc issue. But you've added more too it.

Merc's don't receive too many benefits tbh. The EW trophies and wings and nothing else. Perhaps the merc's can be given some more reward as well (Gold payment for their services or maybe even a free-trail of the castle.)

I disagree, mercs should not receive too many benefits. IMO we want mercs less inclined to want to join EW. In a battle between two guilds, one high level with mercs off, and the other one low level with mercs on, would just be punishing the high level guild who prefers to battle without mercs because the mercs will want a reward from EW and only have one guild open to join.
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#71 Nolanvoid

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 01:11 PM

The mercenary system may be better for those that cannot usually participate in Emporia Wars to experience Emporia Wars rather than using it to try to out power another guild.
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#72 Yurai

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Posted 19 December 2011 - 09:46 PM

The mercenary system may be better for those that cannot usually participate in Emporia Wars to experience Emporia Wars rather than using it to try to out power another guild.


The problem is that any guild that actually has a chance of winning the war will not be allowing mercs into the fight. Those who do allow mercs have an inherent disadvantage since the mercs will be people who do not normally participate in Emporia, and thus do not understand the mechanics behind it and are likely to be detrimental to the team they are mercing for, regardless of their intent.
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#73 Coolsam

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 11:29 AM

I say.... let their be tutorial mode!
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#74 Nolanvoid

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 03:37 PM

The problem is that any guild that actually has a chance of winning the war will not be allowing mercs into the fight. Those who do allow mercs have an inherent disadvantage since the mercs will be people who do not normally participate in Emporia, and thus do not understand the mechanics behind it and are likely to be detrimental to the team they are mercing for, regardless of their intent.


I was noting this under an ideal situation and not the way it currently is right now in-game.
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#75 Maronu

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 06:53 PM

As others have said, need to be able to invite the people you want or control who joins somehow if you want the merc system to be useful.
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