Regarding Monster DNA - Page 2 - Patch Notes - WarpPortal Community Forums

Jump to content


Photo

Regarding Monster DNA


193 replies to this topic

#26 2534130520102140553

2534130520102140553

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 334 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:32 AM



I don't think it's possible for them to code that though...Is it? The raid cooldown idea.

 

This is from a C# point of view, and my apologies if I got any syntax wrong (shouldn't change the fact that it's definitely possible), but I'm sure it can be done in most languages:

 

 

class Boss {

 

    private static List<int> petStunLastUsed = new List<int>();
    private static const AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS = 3;
    private static const PET_STUN_COOLDOWN_TIME = 3600; //120 seconds at a rate of 30 updates per second

 

    Boss (/*constructor arguments*/) {

 

        for (int i = 0; i < AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS; i++) {

 

            petStunLastUsed.Add(0);

 

        }

 

    }

 

    public stunBoss (int stunID) {

 

        if (stunID < petStunLastUsed.Count() && petStunLastUsed[stunID] <= 0) {

 

            //stun the boss

            petStunLastUsed[stunID] = PET_STUN_COOLDOWN_TIME;

 

        }

 

    }

 

    public update (/*update function arguments*/) {

 

        for (int i = 0; i < AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS; i++) {

 

            if (petStunLastUsed[i] > 0) {

 

                petStunLastUsed[i]--

 

            }

 

        }

 

    }

 

}

 

 

 

Where petStunLastUsed is a list of cooldown times for the pet stuns.

 

Yaaaaay, I solved the pet crisis!  I can haz job at Gravity nao? : D


Edited by 2534130520102140553, 27 September 2013 - 09:35 AM.

  • 2

#27 ChopChopz

ChopChopz

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 164 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:33 AM

It would not have been too late if there was no raid reset event.

Now one week of  progression essentaily equals to one month.

 

i.e. two months late when 10/10


Edited by ChopChopz, 27 September 2013 - 09:36 AM.

  • 0

#28 GuardianTK

GuardianTK

    They pay me to post.

  • RO Fungineering
  • 9388 posts
  • LocationIn a certain mansion
  • Playing:Nothing
  • Server:Chaos Renewal + Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:34 AM

But the term impossible implies a general statement

 

Touche


  • 0

#29 LucretiaBlade

LucretiaBlade

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 45 posts
  • LocationSomewhere in England, eating chocolate <3 NOMMERS!
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:35 AM

Because they are the community managers, not the developers.  They can only listen to everyone bitch and complain and go to bat and hope the devs listen.  

 

Look, it nullifies the interaction between actual people.  I get it.  It's cheapened a factor of this game that involved learning how to navigate raids as a balanced team.  Totally with you all on that, but on the same token, people who spent tons of money to get the desired pets don't want it reversed.  I, personally, wouldn't invest my actual hard earned money on a pet to make me have to play less, but that could be just me....

Reading these threads is making my head spin.  There is literally no way to please 100% of the population.  No way at all.  

 

^ This. I think if Tisarahtops head is spinning it's a fair bet that the CMs and GMs heads are too - they're damned if they do, damned if they don't. Can't be fun being the filling between those who make the game and those who play.

 

I am with Trisarahtops on seeing both sides, and understanding the gripe of FS and tanks. I also realise that the general concensus will likely win and so will enjoy the pets (I worked hard to collect) in their current state for as long as I can.

 

 

EDit: p.s. there's a certain irony in there being parallel threads about DNA collection for pets vs the impact the same pets are having on the game.

 


Edited by LucretiaBlade, 27 September 2013 - 09:41 AM.

  • 3

#30 NuwaChan

NuwaChan

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 439 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:36 AM

Here are 2 ways to nerf Embus and Ermeis in a raid:

 

Make their AOE effect both friend and foe.

 

Another way would be to apply the dimishing returns debuff that Frost Diver has to Ermies and Embus. 


Edited by NuwaChan, 27 September 2013 - 09:41 AM.

  • 1

#31 HunkSurvivor

HunkSurvivor

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1433 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:Chaos

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:40 AM

yay >w<!!!


  • 0

#32 foxfight

foxfight

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 277 posts
  • LocationCanada
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:RE:START Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:43 AM

Pets banned from Colo. Pet min cool down on bosses 120 sec.

Rollback on random DNA boxes.

 

 


  • 2

#33 elvenne

elvenne

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 427 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:Chaos

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:46 AM

Thanks! There is hope now.

 

Bosses should be completely immune to CC though (same as they are with palyer's CC). You can still stun/freeze the adds if you need. And it helps a lot.


  • 5

#34 Olets

Olets

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 72 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:47 AM

just make all bosses immune from stun and frozen status. and no pets in colo.


  • 2

#35 englishtealite

englishtealite

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 106 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:48 AM

so just out of curiousity, if pets get nerfed and simply CC doesn't work on bosses or removed from colo etc

 

how would you compensate the people who paid real money to buy these DNA boxes because they thought pets would stay the way they are?

 

are you going to refund people or say "we made new updates to pets, sorry" lol

 

you already milked people for money already and that's being brutally honest

 

i want to continue to play RO2, but at this state - the decision is terribly fucking poor - step up your game


  • 2

#36 2534130520102140553

2534130520102140553

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 334 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:49 AM



 

This is from a C# point of view, and my apologies if I got any syntax wrong (shouldn't change the fact that it's definitely possible), but I'm sure it can be done in most languages:

 

 

class Boss {

 

    private static List<int> petStunLastUsed = new List<int>();
    private static const AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS = 3;
    private static const PET_STUN_COOLDOWN_TIME = 3600; //120 seconds at a rate of 30 updates per second

 

    Boss (/*constructor arguments*/) {

 

        for (int i = 0; i < AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS; i++) {

 

            petStunLastUsed.Add(0);

 

        }

 

    }

 

    public stunBoss (int stunID) {

 

        if (stunID < petStunLastUsed.Count() && petStunLastUsed[stunID] <= 0) {

 

            //stun the boss

            petStunLastUsed[stunID] = PET_STUN_COOLDOWN_TIME;

 

        }

 

    }

 

    public update (/*update function arguments*/) {

 

        for (int i = 0; i < AMOUNT_OF_PET_STUNS; i++) {

 

            if (petStunLastUsed[i] > 0) {

 

                petStunLastUsed[i]--

 

            }

 

        }

 

    }

 

}

 

 

 

Where petStunLastUsed is a list of cooldown times for the pet stuns.

 

Yaaaaay, I solved the pet crisis!  I can haz job at Gravity nao? : D

 

BTW, I spent all of 5 minutes on this, I don't want to hear that it's far more complicated and would take a while, no matter what system they have I don't think it should take a team of professional programmers more than a day to do this.


  • 0

#37 AmiiMii

AmiiMii

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1537 posts
  • LocationWarpportal Forums (RO2)
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:51 AM

The Best Way Of Making These pet's not over-powered from what others have said are:

 

  • 1.Nerfing stun's completely on bosses only. (So they no longer work on bosses relevantly)
  • 2.Reduce the chances of stun/CC on bosses or Players/mobs. (not have a complete 100% chance to stun or CC and have a LOW chance rather than a HIGH one.)
  • 3.Add More Cool down Time?
  • 4. OR Have a Reflection Option From the pets attacks. (for example, if stun/cc attempts to hit a boss, a boss can reflect the stun/cc on the player who brang out the pet, (Boss skill reflect) OR Stun/CC reflecting armor (chance) )

Option 2 could be better.


Edited by AmiiMii, 27 September 2013 - 09:59 AM.

  • 2

#38 StrawberriKiwi

StrawberriKiwi

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 485 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:54 AM

The Best Way Of Making These pet's not over-powered from what others have said are:

 

  • 1.Nerfing stun's completely on bosses only.
  • 2.Reduce the chances of stun/CC on bosses or Players/mobs. (not have a complete 100% chance to stun or CC)
  • 3.Add More Cooldown Time?

Option 2 could be better.

 

That would be good too. But .... who knows, maybe they'll be like we can't script this either :P 


  • 0

#39 elvenne

elvenne

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 427 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:Chaos

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:01 AM

They can change stun the pets skills - to do damage or buff players. However, I think it's already perfectly fine to use them for controlling adds (that's even OP as adds would be a huge pain without these pets)


Edited by elvenne, 27 September 2013 - 10:04 AM.

  • 2

#40 mysticalre

mysticalre

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 837 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:20 AM

The Best Way Of Making These pet's not over-powered from what others have said are:

 

  • 1.Nerfing stun's completely on bosses only. (So they no longer work on bosses relevantly)
  • 2.Reduce the chances of stun/CC on bosses or Players/mobs. (not have a complete 100% chance to stun or CC and have a LOW chance rather than a HIGH one.)
  • 3.Add More Cool down Time?
  • 4. OR Have a Reflection Option From the pets attacks. (for example, if stun/cc attempts to hit a boss, a boss can reflect the stun/cc on the player who brang out the pet, (Boss skill reflect) OR Stun/CC reflecting armor (chance) )

Option 2 could be better.

2 - say there's a lower CC chance ---> get more people to stun/CC (2-3 at a time?)

3 - say there's more cooldown --> get more people with stun pets

4 - say I cast a stun pet, and I get stunned myself completely, what about my other 9 raid members?

 

 

Remember, you only need 2 people with the current system to completely bug a boss. Do NOT make changes so that the only difference is that instead of 2 people with pet stuns, you need 7-8. It's the same all over again. I'd recommend getting it right the first time and adding complete immunities. Several months down the road, everyone will have 60-80%++ completion, and it'll become common all over again.

 

Regardless whether the immunities are temporary or permanent, the important part is that the bosses must be immune to stun/CC for a reasonable amount of time (and reasonable intervals). You can choose complete immunity or choose a temporary ~10s immunity, both are fine but the immunity needs to be there. Not misses, not cooldowns, those are all solvable by just getting more people with these pets.

 

Both approaches are fine. The problem is, we have experience with kRO2 Devs, and the bugs they introduce, and the amount of time it takes to fix bugs, and their attitude towards exploits.

 

Do we want them to implement a "complicated temporary immunity" or a "complicated cooldown" pet system which has potential for exploits/bugs? Remember - we're talking about RO2, a game that hasn't been so ... bug-free in the past.

 

I feel like there is only one chance where they will put so much time and effort into fixing the pet system, and that chance is now. If they add something which can possibly be exploited once again in the future, you can expect it not to get worked on again for a very long time.

 

That's why I'd argue that it's better to take the safe and simple way out, and add complete immunities.


  • 3

#41 HunkSurvivor

HunkSurvivor

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1433 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:Chaos

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:31 AM

M for meow


  • 0

#42 ROAdikMaster

ROAdikMaster

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 406 posts
  • LocationROAdikMaster™ Company Limited
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:R.O.A.M. HQ

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:33 AM

Removing pets in colo is fine but removing/nerfing the pets in raids are not.

 

 

I agree to nerf CC pets in raid dungeon bosses if they can complete the following raid in the given setup:


-Complete COA H without VIP*, Kafra shop consumables*(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above COA N including colo gears.

-Complete AOD N without VIP*, Kafra shop consumables*(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above COA H excluding colo gears.

-Complete AOD H without VIP*, Kafra shop consumables*(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above AOD N excluding colo gears.

 

Your not allowed to use the following pets for completing these challenges: Baphomet Jr., Imverse of Ruins, Executer Undead, Eremes and Giant Driller.

*This applies to Kafra shop consumables that are bought in shop, you can still use these consumables if you get these items through event rewards (the "E" above their items)

 

if they can succeed this raid with the setup mentioned above then i'll agree to the nerf of CC pets, otherwise, stay the CC pets as it is currently now.

 


Edited by ROAdikMaster, 28 September 2013 - 01:13 AM.

  • 3

#43 Audn

Audn

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 573 posts
  • LocationNew Bark Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:34 AM

The easy way out is for bosses to be immune to all CC from pets or players, since they already are immune to all player's stuns (except maya, she can be stunned because she's a noob).


  • 4

#44 StrawberriKiwi

StrawberriKiwi

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 485 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 10:43 AM

The easy way out is for bosses to be immune to all CC from pets or players, since they already are immune to all player's stuns (except maya, she can be stunned because she's a noob).

 

Maya's gonna come whip ur ass in AOD just cuz u said that >:D 


  • 1

#45 foxfight

foxfight

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 277 posts
  • LocationCanada
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online
  • Server:RE:START Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:09 AM

2v8sn6t_th.png2jb15kz.jpg

 

For you signature needs.


  • 0

#46 SoraOfKHK

SoraOfKHK

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1319 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin, Channels 1-5

Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:19 AM

so just out of curiousity, if pets get nerfed and simply CC doesn't work on bosses or removed from colo etc

 

how would you compensate the people who paid real money to buy these DNA boxes because they thought pets would stay the way they are?

 

are you going to refund people or say "we made new updates to pets, sorry" lol

 

you already milked people for money already and that's being brutally honest

 

I honestly think the release of DNA boxes, then deciding they're gonna fix these issues, was a bit shady on the Developers' end, but the fact remains that no one said that the ability to use these pets in Colo and to use them to use CC on Bosses would stay forever. It should've been obvious that it would've been fixed eventually, and people who paid to have the easier way out without considering things could be fixed did so of their own will just to get ahead, and thus, in this matter, Developers can only really be blamed for leaving things in as long as they have.

 

 

Though, on that note, I am starting to find it fun competing against people with these Pets and still being able to beat them anyway. Maybe they should implement an option for every Colo hour to enter a separate Colo that allows use of Pets. Obviously, you could still only enter one Colo during the Colo times, but you could choose to enter one that allows Pets, and one that does not.


Edited by SoraOfKHK, 27 September 2013 - 11:22 AM.

  • 0

#47 Sehee

Sehee

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 180 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:29 AM

This is -_- ridiculous,  I think I spent more time frozen that actually running o killing something, and instead of tab searching for my victims, i was like "no don't run there, there's a pet there, no not there, avoid that"


  • 2

#48 9632130515120055620

9632130515120055620

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 742 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:49 AM

Also, pets in dungeons and raids being used in place of tanks and healers is not an intended feature of pets. 

The culrpit behind all of this is basically Embus of Ruin, but stun chaining is pretty bad too. Tanks are not needed in raids because there is nothing to tank when a boss is completely immobilized from full health to nothing without a chance of retaliating. Priests aren't needed because there's no damage to heal off. So all that's needed are DPS classes to down the punching bags as fast as possible. 

 

I don't think healing pets need looking at to be honest -- pets are supposed to be there to help add damage, give friendly buffs or inflict *non-gamebreaking* debuffs on enemies, just not completely render a boss useless, and healing pets really help out on the solo farming aspect of things. I've tried willow worker a lot in raids and while it does help, it's quite limited in usage. A healing pet simply cannot output the same healing power as a Priest and doesn't have multiple methods of dealing with situations.


  • 2

#49 virus4413

virus4413

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 17 posts

Posted 27 September 2013 - 11:56 AM

Removing pets in colo is fine but removing/nerfing the pets in raids are not.

 

 

I agree to nerf CC pets in raid dungeon bosses if they can complete the following raid in the given setup:


-Complete COA H without VIP, Kafra shop consumables(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above COA N including colo gears.

-Complete AOD N without VIP, Kafra shop consumables(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above COA H excluding colo gears.

-Complete AOD H without VIP, Kafra shop consumables(i.e spinel, pills, graham potions, etc.), and no gears above AOD N excluding colo gears.

 

Your not allowed to use the following pets for completing these challenges: Baphomet Jr., Imverse of Ruins, Executer Undead, Eremes and Giant Driller.

 

if they can succeed this raid with the set mentioned above then i'll agree to the nerf of CC pets, otherwise, stay the CC pets as it is currently now.

 

 

 

no comment....lol


  • 0

#50 Audn

Audn

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 573 posts
  • LocationNew Bark Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:00 PM

Maya's gonna come whip ur ass in AOD just cuz u said that > :D

 

That's maya purple, her older veteran sister :x
 


  • 0



Reply to this topic



  


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users