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#76 Pelisa

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:38 PM

Ok the simple fact that you have alot more access too better gear and you have no exp loss along with more access too gear.....thanks for that last piece of input. And Kaden There not Balanced what so ever. are they better than most at 150 definetly...But its so crazy too get them too 150 that most people are even discouraged too try and when you get lag and 3% exp loss on valk as where you dont on ymir things add up along with the natural 150% exp bonus. Come play on valk before you talk about how easy it is too level.


I've been leveling without god items. i got 110-125 in 2 days. please inform me on how its so hard to level without god items because i don't see where this is coming from.
Problem is with people being lazy -_-s now that they cant lolthorsleech tbh not with who has god items.

ps: 110-125 cost me 4m in ice creams, that's it.
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#77 Myzery

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 04:23 PM

I've been leveling without god items. i got 110-125 in 2 days. please inform me on how its so hard to level without god items because i don't see where this is coming from.
Problem is with people being lazy -_-s now that they cant lolthorsleech tbh not with who has god items.

ps: 110-125 cost me 4m in ice creams, that's it.


It's later on that it's slow.
You were also using Acedia's god items in your earlier lvls when you were in magma.
Not to mention you have also been lvling in Juperos with a triple spawn event, so of course it's fast.
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#78 MagicHands

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 06:01 PM

Yea and why is he back in Ymir? I mean i dont think you have too pay to play on valk at least i know that much. I may not have been playing before valk but i have been playing ever since the open Misery, oops i think i spoke a little too soon.
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#79 MagicHands

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 06:33 PM

I've been leveling without god items. i got 110-125 in 2 days. please inform me on how its so hard to level without god items because i don't see where this is coming from.
Problem is with people being lazy -_-s now that they cant lolthorsleech tbh not with who has god items.

ps: 110-125 cost me 4m in ice creams, that's it.

Oh and i dont level because i not only have a job but its also in the Army....so i dont get much free time as well. I am saying its way too difficult or expensive too level a Sura compared too almost if not all other classes, because the only reason anyone ever parties with them is for Mental strength and there outdone 10x over by RKs or RG's, so soloing is pretty much the only alternative of leveling and even that does not compare to most classes.
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#80 MagicHands

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 06:37 PM

and Myzery you still dont even have a Sura so what valuable input do you have?
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#81 Kokotewa

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 08:05 PM

and Myzery you still dont even have a Sura so what valuable input do you have?

Yes he does, Suras are balanced and I would recommend to stop calling out people before you make a fool of yourself.
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#82 ArmaniExchange

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 08:17 PM

Yes he does, Suras are balanced and I would recommend to stop calling out people before you make a fool of yourself.

errr... unbr soo you dont go on RO ?
all u do is forum lol ?
been trying to contact you all week >_>
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#83 Myzery

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 01:16 AM

and Myzery you still dont even have a Sura so what valuable input do you have?


Like Koko said, I do have a Sura.
What's up with you accusing people of not even playing the class?
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#84 Kaden14

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 03:37 AM

I think a big part of the problem with leveling suras was the rampage blast nerf.

The devs seemed to have at least put some thought into giving skills to suras that they could level with. The earlier level skills aren't amazing but they are useable to get you to mid level 3rd class. Originally, once you got up to the 130 range, you had rb to look forward to. With the old rb, you could easily one shot things like dragons and bio 2 monsters. rb is pretty much designed to be a skill for one shotting mobs and if you can't one shot the monsters, then you can't use rb to level on them because of the huge cooldown and the long setup.

This was the perfect leveling tool for higher level suras to reach 150 and I think the devs planned it out well originally. However, the skill ended up being completely op in pvp and was then nerfed all around without putting any thought into how much that screws suras pvm-wise.

Currently, rampage blast is pretty much useless unless you have 2 megs. It takes having 2 megs, lvl 5 change, RD 10 and around 120 str to even one shot bio 2 monsters with rb and I still wasn't able to one shot dragons with that setup + foods.

So yeah, rb was definitely meant to be a pvm skill. They should change rb back to how it was prior to the nerf in pvm only and leave it the way it is now in pvp.

Edited by Kaden14, 17 November 2010 - 06:00 AM.

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#85 Akarii

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 04:26 AM

I agree.
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#86 pomdjyer

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 04:36 AM

I think a big part of the problem with leveling suras was the rampage blast nerf.

The devs seemed to have at least put some thought into giving skills to suras that they could level with. The earlier level skills aren't amazing but they are useable to get you to mid level 3rd class. Originally, once you got up to the 130 range, you had rb to look forward to. With the old rb, you could easily one shot things like dragons and bio 2 monsters. rb is pretty much designed to be a skill for one shotting mobs and if you can't one shot the monsters, then you can't use rb to level on them because of the huge cooldown and the long setup.

This was the perfect leveling tool for higher level suras to reach 150 and I think the devs planned it out well originally. However, the skill ended up being completely op in pvp and was then nerfed all around without putting any thought into how much that screws suras pvm-wise.

Currently, rampage blast is pretty much useless unless you have 2 megs. It takes having 2 megs, lvl 5 change, RD 5 and around 120 str to even one shot bio 2 monsters with rb and I still wasn't able to one shot dragons with that setup + foods.

So yeah, rb was definitely meant to be a pvm skill. They should change rb back to how it was prior to the nerf in pvm only and leave it the way it is now in pvp.


I totally agree with Jonathan here.
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#87 Myzery

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 05:57 AM

Pretty much, just disable it on pvp/woe maps.
Suras have many other skills to kill with.
Once more get to 150, there will be a flood of tears. Might as well start building the arc now.

Edited by Myzery, 17 November 2010 - 05:58 AM.

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#88 Pururu

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 04:01 AM

Posted Image

Two errors here...
1)Gentle touch - Energy gain isn't equal to gentle touch - silence, please fix the image above so i can see energy gain instead of silence.
2)what is mili? I guess it's supposed to mean melee <_<
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#89 Anibe

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 05:19 AM

Also add a space between the 'minute' word and the seconds (sounds silly but it's the kind of stuff that gets fixed instantly [or it just doesn't happen] in any other game).

Edited by Anibe, 23 November 2010 - 05:19 AM.

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#90 Disenchanter

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 01:36 AM

http://forums.warppo...-suras-sprites/

http://img535.images...valkyrie037.jpg

http://img137.images...valkyrie034.jpg
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#91 Skank

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 11:23 AM

on a genetic (one of the lowest hp classes in the game, which with perfect gears usually caps out at around 34k) i have to pot seeds to live an unbelted hells gate. i am not advocating for it's nerf, though if I had to guess it will likely be changed by korea.
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#92 JAYRAD

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 12:41 PM

hell gate is the new gfist. youre telling me you were able to live every fist youve ever taken? hell gate is good for what it is, requires a lot of skill points to get and a more or less dedicated build.
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#93 Theoretical

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 06:50 PM

I feel Lion Howling should have its delay reduced, or its attack power increased significantly, or fear status should be easier to inflict on monsters...90% maybe?

Earth Shaker is a first tier Sura spell, but is extremely weak.....some could argue its just made to knock people out of hide. O-K. Thats a fair argument...one could also argue that its a first tier spell, and deserves no real power behind it.
I feel this skill should be greater than the damage of Dragon combo.
Dragon combo is easy to cast, easy to spam. And does 380% damage at max level. Yes it is a higher investment of skill points, but it also has a chance to stun. and unlocks the ability to cast insanely powerful skills.....
Earth shaker maxed should at least deal what dragon combo does. Which is 380%. However, I feel it should be at least 800% with a slightly increased delay. And the damage versus hidden should be in the 1200-1400% range.

Just some ideas to spice up a weaker aoe build that focus's on using lion howling/earth shaker instead of going all the way to rampage blaster and using that for everything...

Maybe we could have earth shaker consume some spheres, to rival lightning ride?

Edited by Theoretical, 02 December 2010 - 09:16 PM.

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#94 Theoretical

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 09:21 PM

Bump.

Here is an exchange I had with Doddler a few minutes ago on the Yggdrasil server. (( Hope he doesn't mind ))
Posted Image
Posted Image
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#95 Bomm

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 04:30 AM

I don't know why you think some skills "should" be stronger than they already are. Why "should" they? Sura is already tard overpowered, buffing their non-OP skills will not make them a more balanced class.
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#96 Theoretical

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 09:43 PM

It would be nice to have other build options than rampage blaster.
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#97 Pururu

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 02:21 AM

You have ride lightning aswell, rampage blaster you can't even use it before level 27-28 at full power which means you would have used a first neuralizer to get it earlier and will have to use another neuralizer to finally get skill you want to begin with.
Sura definitly don't need some love in the low job skills cause the skills they can't get until job 40+ in leveling mode are stupidly powerfull, and after you use a neuralizer it's starting to get even more ridiculous.
All that class need is to be nerfed on every single good skills so after they use their neuralizer after reaching max level they don't suddenly become unstoppable beings. I think it would be fair.

What you need to understand here, blame neuralizer in a way for making sura even more overpowered than they should be. Without those they would have slightly less option in good skills making them "less" powerfull unless they get leeched. I just hope that class get redisigned one day so low skills becomes decent and high powerfull becomes actually balanced and not that ridiculously strong, not just nerfed everywhere because that would probably make the class unattractive.

Just look at those, the first one is a ka build after resetting, you don't have any aoe skill, and you have every single buffs the sura can offer aswell (more damage/less hp and the +15% maxhp), you also can get knuckle arrow your damage skill at job 20 maxed but no more spheres until like 25. Not much control with cc but still enough for what it supposed to do. Your now a loved buffer and a really decent killer.

Final pvp/woe build

Now the leveling build, forget about the overpowered buffs would be a waste to take one if not maxed, so you get max curced circle instead for more control or a mix between cure and cc if you want, you lose powerfull buffs for crappy aoe skills basically but it's already a huge factor in my opinion, also you wont get knuckle arrow until job 42 generally. You are huh... well you can kill, i'd say it's still decent though, just not as good that it could be. You can get less spheres (which means less hp/sp aswell), low level cc and no rb aswell in order to get max buff, it's another option but leveling would be harder and ka less spammable, ouch.

Leveling build

This is a leveling build including goh instead of ka cause i know people like it more, as you can see you can't even max goh, and your cc is a laughable 3x3 aoe, if you manage to do it without rampage blaster you can max it and level cc to level 2 maybe, still not as good than what you could with a neuralizer. Without including leveling skill, it's max level (one more range + some extra damage) and you can max out cc for example for a total control of your target life. You can use the last skill points in windmill and tiger cannon level 6 for more aoe aswell :D
Your now a slaughterer, you do huge spike at range, in melee, you can destroy enemy sp and make them sit instead of doing less huge spike with less range, and having troubel to do cc-> fist on the good target.

GoH + leveling build?

It's really important to note that ride lightning and rampage blaster are terribly bad in pvp/woe, it's a huge waste of skill points.
My conclusion on that class is that it's just plainly badly designed and frustrating thus being a reason it doesn't seems popular on valkyrie ( i saw like 3 yesterday, one which was able to curced circle -> fist, two who were able to fist while praying nobody would hide, and there was probably the max level one spamming goh and cc -> fist/goh combo).
I also don't mean the class is bad (i kinda am though so it balance it out anyway), far from it, some class are actually badly designed and bad at max level (mechanic wanderer cough cough), sura are just badly designed and overpowered at the end.

Edited by Pururu, 08 December 2010 - 03:19 AM.

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#98 Daray

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 03:58 AM

It would be nice to have other build options than rampage blaster.


I'm giving Sky Blow a shot, get em all together, snap into position (next to a wall) and spam that :D.
(it does not cost a spirit like the tooltip says)

edit: also you can get it at a lower Jlvl, which eases the pain I guess.

Edited by Daray, 08 December 2010 - 03:59 AM.

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#99 MagicHands

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 02:58 PM

You have ride lightning aswell, rampage blaster you can't even use it before level 27-28 at full power which means you would have used a first neuralizer to get it earlier and will have to use another neuralizer to finally get skill you want to begin with.
Sura definitly don't need some love in the low job skills cause the skills they can't get until job 40+ in leveling mode are stupidly powerfull, and after you use a neuralizer it's starting to get even more ridiculous.
All that class need is to be nerfed on every single good skills so after they use their neuralizer after reaching max level they don't suddenly become unstoppable beings. I think it would be fair.

What you need to understand here, blame neuralizer in a way for making sura even more overpowered than they should be. Without those they would have slightly less option in good skills making them "less" powerfull unless they get leeched. I just hope that class get redisigned one day so low skills becomes decent and high powerfull becomes actually balanced and not that ridiculously strong, not just nerfed everywhere because that would probably make the class unattractive.

Just look at those, the first one is a ka build after resetting, you don't have any aoe skill, and you have every single buffs the sura can offer aswell (more damage/less hp and the +15% maxhp), you also can get knuckle arrow your damage skill at job 20 maxed but no more spheres until like 25. Not much control with cc but still enough for what it supposed to do. Your now a loved buffer and a really decent killer.

Final pvp/woe build

Now the leveling build, forget about the overpowered buffs would be a waste to take one if not maxed, so you get max curced circle instead for more control or a mix between cure and cc if you want, you lose powerfull buffs for crappy aoe skills basically but it's already a huge factor in my opinion, also you wont get knuckle arrow until job 42 generally. You are huh... well you can kill, i'd say it's still decent though, just not as good that it could be. You can get less spheres (which means less hp/sp aswell), low level cc and no rb aswell in order to get max buff, it's another option but leveling would be harder and ka less spammable, ouch.

Leveling build

This is a leveling build including goh instead of ka cause i know people like it more, as you can see you can't even max goh, and your cc is a laughable 3x3 aoe, if you manage to do it without rampage blaster you can max it and level cc to level 2 maybe, still not as good than what you could with a neuralizer. Without including leveling skill, it's max level (one more range + some extra damage) and you can max out cc for example for a total control of your target life. You can use the last skill points in windmill and tiger cannon level 6 for more aoe aswell :P
Your now a slaughterer, you do huge spike at range, in melee, you can destroy enemy sp and make them sit instead of doing less huge spike with less range, and having troubel to do cc-> fist on the good target.

GoH + leveling build?

It's really important to note that ride lightning and rampage blaster are terribly bad in pvp/woe, it's a huge waste of skill points.
My conclusion on that class is that it's just plainly badly designed and frustrating thus being a reason it doesn't seems popular on valkyrie ( i saw like 3 yesterday, one which was able to curced circle -> fist, two who were able to fist while praying nobody would hide, and there was probably the max level one spamming goh and cc -> fist/goh combo).
I also don't mean the class is bad (i kinda am though so it balance it out anyway), far from it, some class are actually badly designed and bad at max level (mechanic wanderer cough cough), sura are just badly designed and overpowered at the end.

+1 Totally agree. I think its hard too make a decent build untill youve pretty much 150. KA is easily outpottable by most classes.It would be nice too see them up the damage but more of a delay, making it a tad more balanced. With Rampage Blast i think that the damage would be great if the cast delay was taken away by a good amount, i mean we need RD 10 to do any damage worth mentioning, and the amount of preperation is long enough as well. Sky Blow is a great skill worth using but it fits nowhere into any of the skills used later on. Like someone mentioned earlier earth shaker is completely useless i think it should be spammable or at least do more damage.
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#100 LethalJokeChar

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 03:22 PM

My main issues are with gate of hell and snap. When monk first came out, snap ate up ALL your skill points and you were left with mediocre skills... but incredible mobility. Then champ came and basically, all weaknesses of a snap build vanished, and just about every decent champ got it.

Now with sura out, the 2nd class skill requirements are so lax, that getting snap is absolutely NO problem for them. Now couple it with rising dragon, zen, fury, gate of hell, gfist, and you have something completely ridiculous. I saw this video where a single champ just kept pwning a full guild of people. And basically his only strategy was to keep snapping away like a-_- and prepare his spheres just to rinse-repeat his one-shot skills over and over.

I propose this, at least. Gate of hell gets a 1 sec fixed cast time (or something around there. less fixed time and more variable time?). Snap gets a .2 sec fixed cast time, a 2 sec re-use delay, 2 sec delay for gfist (how it was before) and gate of hell, and .5 sec skill delay for everything else.

Oh, and how about gentle touch - cure? Get rid of stun, frozen, and petrify status on YOURSELF, for the cost of just 1 sphere? That's like infinite get out of jail free cards in monopoly without even having to go to jail and moving on your third doubles. If you're going to free yourself from such statuses you probably should have naturally resisted with stats anyway, the price for that should be heavy. Like 5 spheres. And it also doesn't seem fair at all that they can cure gx poisons.

Edited by LethalJokeChar, 09 December 2010 - 03:31 PM.

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