210 replies to this topic

[Sapphic]

You have a really narrow concept about what is fair in this game that is neither logical nor reasonable.

Show me another game where a tank can 1 shot people, while with the same conditions (e.g., lex, deep sleep), a pure offensive class with lower hp/def/etc cannot 1 shot (e.g., mechanic, ranger, warlock), and I will show you a game that is as crummy and unbalanced as RO.

You also seem to be conveniently forgetting pvp/pvm/mvp.

Then stop playing RO? RO was never balanced and it never will be. They aren't really tanks anymore considering how powerful DB is to the point where everyone has to wear fire armor to not die. Mechanics seem to be more supportive now, if you take a good look at their skills. Rangers were always given the short end of the stick and are only really annoying. Warlocks stopped killing once Ele armors became common and turned into crowd control. I don't really understand what nerfing Clashing or Gloomy will even do. So they'll DB more and then what? They only have those TWO skills in their arsenal and Clashing can be avoided in numerous ways. WoE is a team effort. There's no reason to get the GMs to take the time to nerf it for some reason and send in stuff to their devs and get permission and such. It's a waste of time.

Also, I'm glad you say how I'm illogical and unreasonable, but don't really state why. You have this warped concept that this game was ever fair. It wasn't. You just learn to adapt or quit. It's been that way since it started.

Btw, if you need all that to be one shotted by a skill (Gloomy buff + Lex + maybe DSL) then it's not really the skill that's OP, but a good combination of debuffs/buffs. If everyone were lexed 24/7 then everything becomes OP. Also, with the WoE nerf Clashing is 100% no longer an issue and doesn't one shot. It's like you missed me saying that it doesn't one shot anymore, because everyone mostly has really high HP.

PvP is PvP. I kill people with RAINSTORM in PvP. Come on. PvM... you care? I mean it'd be nice if Arrow Vulcan was buffed to be closer to CS, but if you're leveling by killing one at a time, the exp is going to be slow as hell. Plus, they need to drag around a Gloomy slave which is no fun, considering the buff is only 2 and a half minutes. MvP... CS out MVPs Genetics and Suras? Not that it matters, MVPing has its own problems since they're so debuffed that it's all about first hit now.

I can't believe I have to explain any of this.

Edit: If the RK can get Gloomy and get you lexed before killing you (I'm guessing this has happened?) why can't you get an AB or Sura to Pneuma to counter it? Anything? Seriously. You can also Siren / DSL / SoD and all of these will wreck the RK. Use your skills and work together. That is how WoE should be. Things do need to be changed about WoE, but CS definitely should not be on the list. There are so many ways to block it, it's not even funny.

Edited by Sapphic, 14 February 2011 - 01:21 AM.

[Kadelia]

Stopped about halfway through your post.

You're non-sensical because you're defending an overpowered mechanic for no reason. By your logic priests should have clashing spiral too because its easy to pneuma and they have more useful things they should be doing. let's let everyone 1 shot KO monsters up to 115 instead of just Lord Knights. You'll probably post something disagreeing with me because you're one 1) stupid 2) a jackazz.

[Sapphic]

Didn't even read my entire post and now you're resorting to name calling? Brilliant.

Btw, my entire point is that it's not OP and I stated why. Your whole argument is that it one shots with gloomy AND with Lex apparently and I'm saying that point now is especially moot.

Oh no, not one shotting monsters one at a time while dragging around an annoying buff slave? I'm delusional when you think a very unnoticeable skill is OP.

I'm saying you want it debuffed for no reason. I guess we will just disagree forever, not that your very noticeable immaturity helps.

You're saying it's so easy to lex, why isn't it just as easy to pneuma? You won't die without lex for sure with your max HP. Haha and no, I'm not sure how you got "hey it always kills me with lex, so pneuma" mixed up with "let's give ABs Clashing" where does that even come from? If the priest can support correctly by lexing the clashings hitting you, why can't there be a priest countering with Pneuma? It tickles even with gloomy.

By your logic the only reason Clashing is OP is because they carry around Gloomy and Lex with them everywhere they go somehow. Why is Clashing being lexed all the time? There are better skills to Lex for.

No point in arguing with someone who has the mind of a child.

Edited by Sapphic, 14 February 2011 - 04:30 AM.

[Kadelia]

It doesn't take 7 paragraphs to admit you are wrong. That is why I don't read your posts.

Also writing about 4 of those paragraphs about something I never said (gloomy slave) really doesn't make you look smart. Clashing spiral does 3x the damage of any other trans skill performed by a character 55-99 without gloomy.. Either it is OP or every other class in the game is underpowered. You are either 1) incredibly inexperienced and have no idea what you are talking about and nobody should be listening to you or 2) you're a moron and nobody should be listening to you. There isn't an option #3 here.

No point in arguing with someone who has the mind of a child.

I would liken this to telling someone with a PHD in stellar physics that their refusal to admit the universe revolves around earth is like arguing with a child. It paints a picture of absurdity because the unintelligent person with the childlike reasoning is the one saying it, which is ironic. But thank you for lightening my day with your silly antics.

Edited by Jaye, 14 February 2011 - 06:06 AM.

[Sapphic]

Clashing is so weak without Gloomy it's not even funny. I think you are the only person in all of RO who cares about Clashing damage without Gloomy. How silly. You talked about Lex and Gloomy previously, but now you are saying it is OP without Gloomy and Lex. Strange.

The reason you are childish is because now you are just pouting and saying "no you're wrong I'm right" and you don't really give a good reason. You also resorted to insults. Very childish, no? It's a thread for feedback, not your own personal slander. Calm down, you sound so upset over nothing.

Also the 7 paragraphs were addressing your different points as to why you think Clashing is OP. If you don't read them, hopefully someone who matters will and will understand that Clashing does not need a nerf.

I hope you realize RKs really only have Clashing and DB. At least our classes have a variety of skills to use, 2nd and 3rd.

Your comparison makes 0 sense btw. Apples and Oranges, it's a logical fallacy. Btw If you recall, Gfist is a non-trans skill and it's quite heavy in the damage category. Should we nerf Gfist too, just because you want to cry about how OP it is for being a non 3rd skill?

I have to point out again, RO is heavily unbalanced, but this change is just a waste of time to even consider.

Edited by Sapphic, 14 February 2011 - 01:57 PM.

[Mefistofeles]

Clashing is so weak without Gloomy it's not even funny. I think you are the only person in all of RO who cares about Clashing damage without Gloomy. How silly. You talked about Lex and Gloomy previously, but now you are saying it is OP without Gloomy and Lex. Strange.

The reason you are childish is because now you are just pouting and saying "no you're wrong I'm right" and you don't really give a good reason. You also resorted to insults. Very childish, no? It's a thread for feedback, not your own personal slander. Calm down, you sound so upset over nothing.

Also the 7 paragraphs were addressing your different points as to why you think Clashing is OP. If you don't read them, hopefully someone who matters will and will understand that Clashing does not need a nerf.

I hope you realize RKs really only have Clashing and DB. At least our classes have a variety of skills to use, 2nd and 3rd.

Your comparison makes 0 sense btw. Apples and Oranges, it's a logical fallacy. Btw If you recall, Gfist is a non-trans skill and it's quite heavy in the damage category. Should we nerf Gfist too, just because you want to cry about how OP it is for being a non 3rd skill?

I have to point out again, RO is heavily unbalanced, but this change is just a waste of time to even consider.

UMMMMMMM G fist consumes all sp and the caster need to do previus skills requirements, like the spheres and fury state, clashing spiral of course its op, just look the damage in PVP, with gloomy it can do 190k damage, much more than a champ gfist (CHAMP) i dont know if its bugg, but as far i know is that clashing its always neutral, but i can hit this monster http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1921/ and dies with 2 clashing with no gloomy, also cs can hit like 30k WITH NO GLOOMY IN PVM, when a rapid smiting with gloomy hits like 45k. Please think in the other classes...just look at lazarus, he feels almighty in pvp becouse he can 1 shot almost all classes with 1 clashing spiral with gloomy, also a funny thing a bout cs, (that you say its not op...blah blah) its that CANT be stoped as the dragons breath, they dont even need phen card, and also CANT BE STOPED IN WOE, ooooooooooh good lord its not op! i will use pneuma with my sorcerer! pim! pim! puuuuum! plash! pneuma!!!!! oh no its not op, just dont get close of it! pum pum pum!!! magic cincada skin with a melee char like a GX!!! and back slide !!!!!! im not near becouse he can 1 shot me!!! and im a gx that wont get near of a non op class!!!!! ooooooooh

Edited by Mefistofeles, 14 February 2011 - 02:21 PM.

[Sapphic]

UMMMMMMM G fist consumes all sp and the caster need to do previus skills requirements, like the spheres and fury state, clashing spiral of course its op, just look the damage in PVP, with gloomy it can do 190k damage, much more than a champ gfist (CHAMP) i dont if its bugg, but as far i know is that clashing its always neutral, but i can hit this monster http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1921/ and dies with 2 clashing with no gloomy, also cs can hit like 30 WITH NO GLOOMY IN PVP, when a rapid smiting with gloomy hits like 45k. Please think in the other classes...just look at lazarus, he feels almighty in pvp becouse he can 1 shot almost all classes with 1 clashing spiral with gloomy, also a funny thing a bout cs, (that you say its not op...blah blah) its that CANT be stoped as the dragons breath, they dont even need phen card, and also CANT BE STOPED IN WOE, ooooooooooh good lord its not op! i will use pneuma with my sorcerer! pim! pim! puuuuum! plash! pneuma!!!!! oh no its not op, just dont get close of it! pum pum pum!!! magic cincada skin with a melee char like a GX!!! and back slide !!!!!! im not near becouse he can 1 shot me!!! and im a gx that wont get near of a non op class!!!!! ooooooooh

Your post is so messy. It'd be nicer if you could make it more cleaner in the future.

She started to talk about Clashing without Gloomy, so...

You care that they can kill Incarnations ? I mean, why care so much about the fact that it's a non 3rd skill? What else do they have compared to most of the other 3rds?

PvP is stupid, I can kill people with Severe Rainstorm.

I only care about its use in WoE and honestly it won't kill you and you can definitely outpot it now.

WoE is a team effort, so you should be having other people Pneuma for you and such. Ridiculous. If they can get Gloomy, you can get Pneuma, or at least wear a Hide Clip.

If you really care about PvP, just Hide and stop being bad. If you're a sorc you can also Fiber / Vaccuum / Arrullo them.

Edit: Gfist... with Rising Dragon is hilariously quick to redo. RD early -> Gifst -> RD again -> Gfist. RD is a 3rd skill just like Gloomy is. SP is never a problem unless you're poor, then you have more problems than just not being able to afford Berries.

Edited by Sapphic, 14 February 2011 - 02:42 PM.

[Mefistofeles]

Your post is so messy. It'd be nicer if you could make it more cleaner in the future.

She started to talk about Clashing without Gloomy, so...

You care that they can kill Incarnations ? I mean, why care so much about the fact that it's a non 3rd skill? What else do they have compared to most of the other 3rds?

PvP is stupid, I can kill people with Severe Rainstorm.

I only care about its use in WoE and honestly it won't kill you and you can definitely outpot it now.

WoE is a team effort, so you should be having other people Pneuma for you and such. Ridiculous. If they can get Gloomy, you can get Pneuma, or at least wear a Hide Clip.

If you really care about PvP, just Hide and stop being bad. If you're a sorc you can also Fiber / Vaccuum / Arrullo them.

Edit: Gfist... with Rising Dragon is hilariously quick to redo. RD early -> Gifst -> RD again -> Gfist. RD is a 3rd skill just like Gloomy is. SP is never a problem unless you're poor, then you have more problems than just not being able to afford Berries.

XD some cant handle the true, he think that all guilds are full of all classes, pim pum pam! i made a arch bishop in 1 day just to block a non op skill!!!!!! plaaaaaaaaash team lets die all together against the non op db!!!!! yesssss! boooooooooooooom oh no i poisoned i cant cast anything until a royal guard make me sac!!!!!!!! ... a rune say: oh you lazy nerfd class i can cast db and cs no matter how many hits and poisons i have HAUUAUAHUAHAUHAUHA. And i dont even need a phen card! XP boooooooooooom! then the rune fall in a magic hole! its super effective! theres no class that can against that! then the shadow chaser fall in ground......the last thing that he readed was...... storm blast desu!!!!!!!!!! we the rune knights, the non op class, can breake the rules against the common sense!

[Aeolus]

XD some cant handle the true, he think that all guilds are full of all classes, pim pum pam! i made a arch bishop in 1 day just to block a non op skill!!!!!! plaaaaaaaaash team lets die all together against the non op db!!!!! yesssss! boooooooooooooom oh no i poisoned i cant cast anything until a royal guard make me sac!!!!!!!! ... a rune say: oh you lazy nerfd class i can cast db and cs no matter how many hits and poisons i have HAUUAUAHUAHAUHAUHA. And i dont even need a phen card! XP boooooooooooom! then the rune fall in a magic hole! its super effective! theres no class that can against that! then the shadow chaser fall in ground......the last thing that he readed was...... storm blast desu!!!!!!!!!! we the rune knights, the non op class, can breake the rules against the common sense!

Obvious, troll is obvious.














Now stop posting.

[Mefistofeles]

Obvious, troll is obvious.
Now stop posting.

If you pay attention the troll is other, im just making joke of sapphic, read all those weird things that he put in this forum, like: "Clashing spiral with gloomy shyness its no op O,x" and you read more focused, my text is full of common sense

[Sapphic]

You think I'm trolling? Lol. It doesn't kill me in WoE and I have lower HP compared to most other classes. Why would I think it's OP if I never die to it, even with Gloomy?

That was my first post before everyone started going off topic with their own personal agenda.

*I'm 150 and I don't die to it at all in WoE. Are you 150 and does it still kill you in WoE?*

Edited by Sapphic, 14 February 2011 - 10:22 PM.

[Kadelia]

You're trolling because you are posting moronic drivel as if you truly believed it. You should prefer to be called a troll than a moron. Many people claim to be a troll once they realize how ridiculously stupid they've been acting with a serious face.

So yeah, OK. Clashing spiral does enough damage to make you pot or die, can out-damage an arch bishop's high-heal/heal combo, and it's "weak" to you. I wonder what you think of skills like melody strike, acid terror, arrow storm, etc that are actually weak. Actually, I don't. Asking you what you think about something would be as painful to listen to as asking Michael Moore thinks about republicans and equally nonsensical.

If you think not-dying to something makes it weak you have one flucked up sense of how woe should be, and honestly you should be banned from the conversation, because you're whispering seeds of sheettacularness in Gravity's ear. Woe sucks because of your retarded philosophy of requiring all decent/good attacks to 1-2 shot everyone. That is nearly the opposite of what WoE should be, moron. WoE should take skill, persistence, and teamwork, and it should not require you to respawn 100000000x times in 2 hours. Battles should be long and hard, and skills that take even 3-5 hits to kill you should be the norm, not "weak". You're pushing for the game to be retarded because you are.

Clashing spiral is 3x stronger than SD, AV, FAS, etc, and needs to be flucking nerfed so that LK don't get to Rune Knight faster than other jobs get to their third. That is god-dayum common sense you gibbering fool.

Edited by Jaye, 15 February 2011 - 03:12 AM.

[Akin]

This poor thread lol.

[Sapphic]

You're changing your story so much lol. Stick to one thing. You want it nerfed, but I'm saying it's so weak in WoE, it doesn't even need to be looked at. Also lol@ leveling one by one. I'd hope the LK is leveling with Bowling Bash. Seriously.

I don't get your whole WoE rant since you want CS to be even weaker to the point where it's like AV or FAS. Like I said, what other skills do they have except DB? None. Are you going to cry about Acid Bomb and Gfist? Gfist is a non-trans skill, too.

Fact: I don't die to Gloomy CS.
Opinion: CS is OP.

Lol @ calling me a troll because I disagree. I have never once said I was trolling.

Gonna stop posting since this is for Maestro feedback, not RK.

*On an unrelated note, has anyone else noticed that Song of Despair lasts for different amounts of time on different people? It's not even close to what the description says. I can't figure out what affects the time, but it was 6 and 7 seconds or so for two different people. Maybe it's some stat or another.

Edited by Sapphic, 15 February 2011 - 05:45 PM.

[Mefistofeles]

You're trolling because you are posting moronic drivel as if you truly believed it. You should prefer to be called a troll than a moron. Many people claim to be a troll once they realize how ridiculously stupid they've been acting with a serious face.

So yeah, OK. Clashing spiral does enough damage to make you pot or die, can out-damage an arch bishop's high-heal/heal combo, and it's "weak" to you. I wonder what you think of skills like melody strike, acid terror, arrow storm, etc that are actually weak. Actually, I don't. Asking you what you think about something would be as painful to listen to as asking Michael Moore thinks about republicans and equally nonsensical.

If you think not-dying to something makes it weak you have one flucked up sense of how woe should be, and honestly you should be banned from the conversation, because you're whispering seeds of sheettacularness in Gravity's ear. Woe sucks because of your retarded philosophy of requiring all decent/good attacks to 1-2 shot everyone. That is nearly the opposite of what WoE should be, moron. WoE should take skill, persistence, and teamwork, and it should not require you to respawn 100000000x times in 2 hours. Battles should be long and hard, and skills that take even 3-5 hits to kill you should be the norm, not "weak". You're pushing for the game to be retarded because you are.

Clashing spiral is 3x stronger than SD, AV, FAS, etc, and needs to be flucking nerfed so that LK don't get to Rune Knight faster than other jobs get to their third. That is god-dayum common sense you gibbering fool.

What i need to say? i agree? or i love you? XD

[Aeolus]

You're trolling because you are posting moronic drivel as if you truly believed it. You should prefer to be called a troll than a moron. Many people claim to be a troll once they realize how ridiculously stupid they've been acting with a serious face.

So yeah, OK. 1.)Clashing spiral does enough damage to make you pot or die, can out-damage an arch bishop's high-heal/heal combo, and it's "weak" to you. 2.)I wonder what you think of skills like melody strike, acid terror, arrow storm, etc that are actually weak. Actually, I don't. Asking you what you think about something would be as painful to listen to as asking Michael Moore thinks about republicans and equally nonsensical.

If you think not-dying to something makes it weak you have one flucked up sense of how woe should be, and honestly you should be banned from the conversation, because 3.)you're whispering seeds of sheettacularness in Gravity's ear. Woe sucks because of your retarded philosophy of requiring all decent/good attacks to 1-2 shot everyone. That is nearly the opposite of what WoE should be, moron. 4.)WoE should take skill, persistence, and teamwork, and it should not require you to respawn 100000000x times in 2 hours. Battles should be long and hard, and 5.)skills that take even 3-5 hits to kill you should be the norm, not "weak". You're pushing for the game to be retarded because you are.

Clashing spiral is 3x stronger than SD, AV, FAS, etc, and needs to be flucking nerfed so that LK don't get to Rune Knight faster than other jobs get to their third. That is god-dayum common sense you gibbering fool.

1.) Wut? Are you serious? First off AB's are a whole different problem. High Heal/Heal combo is not even useful at all. It can't even out heal regular mobs damage.

2.) Acid Terror has other effects other than just doing damage fyi. The other two were never really meant to do high damage and are on a support class. (Btw you can use melody strike when you're playing a song...also if you're linked and playing strings the strings effects melody strike.) Rainstorm is AoE...this really doesn't need explaining.

3.) Please, please stop posting your nonsensical ideas if you really have no idea what you're talking about. You are actually the problem, not the solution.

4.) First off that word in the middle should not even be there. Second, you really think that everyone can carry 5k pots on them during 2 hours of WoE? Of course you're gonna have to respawn. WoE has always been like this in RO. Do you want them to just make this WoW?

5.) Most of the skills you have been complaining about people have found ways to make them take 3-5 hits at least if not more to kill them.

If you're going to post at least post something of value so I don't have to look over all of this dribble.

Because I know the GM's won't be able to tell the difference between what should be and what shouldn't.


PS: Numbers correspond to numbers. =]

Edited by Aeolus, 15 February 2011 - 06:24 PM.

[Viri]

CS is pretty mediocre once you're high level. The problem is they can get it at level like 70. Why not just make it scale by level? Add in a x(baselevel/150). That way damage is full at 150 and about 2/3 that at 100.

[Mefistofeles]

CS is pretty mediocre once you're high level. The problem is they can get it at level like 70. Why not just make it scale by level? Add in a x(baselevel/150). That way damage is full at 150 and about 2/3 that at 100.

The problem is that its not even a thirdclass skill, and hit more than the cross impact O,O and many other thirdclass skills, specially rangers, all skills except mine bombs have a ridiculus low damage

[Viri]

It also has a cast time and can be casually blocked by pneuma or hide... CS is certainly mediocre in siege.

[Kadelia]

CS is mediocre at 150, but its a trans skill.

it needs to be nerfed because its prime usefulness between 70 and 120 is significantly better than other class' skills. Lord Knight is a tank, this puts their offensive limitations on par with a support character in good games. In RO knight-path is the best of every category for no reason.

So yes the skill is overpowered for where it is and when it should be used. Grossly so. It should be useful with Gloomy as a 3rd job, not the other way around, as gloomy is a 3rd job buff. So nerfing gloomy instead of the base damage of CS makes no sense.

/END CONVERSATION. If you disgree below this line you are dense.

<----------------------------->

[Mefistofeles]

CS is mediocre at 150, but its a trans skill.

it needs to be nerfed because its prime usefulness between 70 and 120 is significantly better than other class' skills. Lord Knight is a tank, this puts their offensive limitations on par with a support character in good games. In RO knight-path is the best of every category for no reason.

So yes the skill is overpowered for where it is and when it should be used. Grossly so. It should be useful with Gloomy as a 3rd job, not the other way around, as gloomy is a 3rd job buff. So nerfing gloomy instead of the base damage of CS makes no sense.

/END CONVERSATION. If you disgree below this line you are dense.

<----------------------------->

Yes cs needs more the nerf than gloomy shyness just try to defeat a lord kinght with any other trans class, thats pretty imposible!

[Aeolus]

Yes cs needs more the nerf than gloomy shyness just try to defeat a lord kinght with any other trans class, thats pretty imposible!

I forgot what champs were also for a minute.
Oh scholars exist too.
Wait what's that Pallies have a skill that reduces ranged damage by 80%?
Other classes could possibly kill an LK pending on gear/skill of the player also.

[Mefistofeles]

I forgot what champs were also for a minute.
Oh scholars exist too.
Wait what's that Pallies have a skill that reduces ranged damage by 80%?
Other classes could possibly kill an LK pending on gear/skill of the player also.

WHAT CAN DO A SCHOLAR? the formula of matk make the bolts usless! i was the only of 5 scholars bolters in pre-renewal(i always hated the fs ones)cs can be stoped, stone curse last nothing and have a fixed cast time from hell, rapid smiting can do like 3k, while a cs can do 2k per hit, rapid smiting can be stoped and have longer cast time, cs consumes less sp, negates def cant be stoped,and now with renewal formula it have a extremly different damage from pre-renewal, now hits like 700%more, wiz have tons of fixed cast, champ have a hell tons of fixed time too AND, GUILLOTINE FIST CONSUMES ALL SP AND USE SPHERES AND FURY, IT CANT BE SPAMED LIKE CS.

[Aeolus]

WHAT CAN DO A SCHOLAR? the formula of matk make the bolts usless! i was the only of 5 scholars bolters in pre-renewal(i always hated the fs ones)cs can be stoped, stone curse last nothing and have a fixed cast time from hell, rapid smiting can do like 3k, while a cs can do 2k per hit, rapid smiting can be stoped and have longer cast time, cs consumes less sp, negates def cant be stoped,and now with renewal formula it have a extremly different damage from pre-renewal, now hits like 700%more, wiz have tons of fixed cast, champ have a hell tons of fixed time too AND, GUILLOTINE FIST CONSUMES ALL SP AND USE SPHERES AND FURY, IT CANT BE SPAMED LIKE CS.

Oh god dude just please stop talking, you have no idea what you are talking about.

[Kadelia]

You should both stop talking. just because another class has options in the fight (many class DO have options-- some don't) doesn't mean the fight isn't weighted/biased in the LK's favor (which it is). Just because a battle is fair when the LK player is crummy and the scholar player is elite doesn't make the LK class balanced for renewal. That is just idiotic logic.