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Pegasus Testing - New Skill Mechanics!


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#376 SlowBob

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:23 AM

it's for all classes hard if they are getting ganged.

But looking at your point knights would need bigger HP pots too (since a lot of them got about 50k HP). The thing is, it would be an overkill, both classes are already strong enoth.


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#377 Soda

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:34 AM

I dont wanna keep repeating myself. So you can just read my previous posts comparing mage to other classes in terms of survivability. All I'm asking is just for MP foods to be used in CD, thats all. And why would you compare HP to MP? .___. if there was a skill that would regain MP in seconds (like heals) then i wont even complain. I know there is Mana Flames but still, i don't want to rely on it.


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#378 jerremy

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:41 AM

The new water passive gives MP recovery, not sure how much though. And in terms of survivability I find a mage tougher to kill than artis or bourgs.


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#379 SlowBob

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:44 AM

And why would you compare HP to MP?

Well in the end you only need that many MP as a mage if you are using your manashield. Means the consumed MP are basicly nothing else than extra HP.

 

So you can just read my previous posts comparing mage to other classes in terms of survivability.

If you compare their damage output too, and not just the survivability, mages would be probably better than all other classes. (That's atleast my opinion)


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#380 Soda

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:46 AM

Oh well since almost all of you are against me i might as well just drop the suggestion. And about mage surviving better than arti/bourg..  Probably because of the new mana shield yes. I own both chars (mage,arti), but tbh they're pretty much equal on the live server. Just on pegasus i survive better on my mage.


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#381 Soda

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:48 AM

Damage is nothing if you die in 5 seconds. No wonder why, almost no one ever plays a mage anymore. Not sure if that would change on the new skill update. We'll have to see.


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#382 SlowBob

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 08:56 AM

In my opinion mages are doing more than well with the new changes. In fact this is the only class i'd recommend to newbies from now.

 

The reasons are:

  • They are the easiest class to lvl
  • They own most other classes in pvp (1vs1)
  • They are dealing the highest AoE damage, which makes them rather powerfull in CD as well as in pvm
  • They can tank more damage than a lot of other classes

In fact i don't see any reason why i shouldn't play mage from now.


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#383 Ahya

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 01:03 PM

Damage is nothing if you die in 5 seconds. No wonder why, almost no one ever plays a mage anymore. Not sure if that would change on the new skill update. We'll have to see.

 

Damage isn't really nothing if you die in 5 seconds. Well, in wars and 1v1 they count. In CDs, since your teammates are mostly focused on gaining points for themselves, well, you can expect yourself to only be able to live if you know some people in your team and you can shout at them for help. Anytime. Being a mage means being prepared to die. Lots and lots of times. Over and over again.

 

Regarding those MP food, yes, I agree, they should be strengthened. To be honest I don't really pay attention to them much because they are so insignificant, I haven't even given them space in my inventory. As of the blue potions, I munch on them alot.


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#384 Feuer

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 01:24 PM

MP pots should recovery a % based amount, so they're useful to all classes, not just some. 


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#385 Genesis

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Posted 09 March 2014 - 07:09 PM

The server has been restarted to address a synchronization issue with Bonfires/Mana Flame and other MP skills.

 

Server is back online!

 

Update: There is a known display issue causing MP or HP to drop to 0 when entering a zone or respawning if you have more than 32,000 HP or MP, which will be corrected for next patch.


Edited by Genesis, 09 March 2014 - 07:27 PM.

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#386 Leonis

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 12:59 PM

jerremy,

Some good suggestions and observations.
The unique skills are something of another matter, but are still being looked at.

Bendersmom,
At the end of it, the same points are given to the appropriate team for every crystal destroyed or defended.

Reflected damage should be considered damage dealt by the defender, as it is their effect that causes the damage, even if the amount of damage is dependent on the attacker's power. It is still dealt as credit by the defender under the reflect effect.
 

raiders really do a lot of damage now and can sneak up on people

That sounds more like how Raiders were intended to be.

Whether they feel too powerful now, we'll have to wait and see on because the amount of play feedback we got wasn't really enough to determine that.

Siphon traps do not stun, they mute. The MP drain will hit friend and foe alike, within the area, so be careful when using them! A trap that does an AoE effect will not be able to recognize friend or foe within its range of exposure. But only an enemy will trigger it's trap!

Traps, although they use the summon system, they are treated unique as if they were a machine, not a creature or being to control once brought out. The summon gauge was used as a means to currently limit the use of the traps. Until we're able to implement something more directly for the number of traps you can lay at a time, that's what we were forced to utilize until then.

I got to play Cleric myself, though I can no way say I'm a great support cleric, I did my best and I felt rewarded for my efforts. But the games we played on Pegasus aren't near the activity we would have hoped to see and expect from the live servers. We'll be watching the results and seeing how it plays out and follow through with further adjustments as needed.

But we applied the outcomes of the few matches we got and the results were encouraging towards what we were hoping. Player who put forth effort compared to their teammates were still rewarded for their effort.
 

I guess since our suggestion about mage animation last time got ignored then ill just summarize everything.

-Remove the animation on wind skills where you have to step back before landing that "thunder" like animation.

-Remove the jumping animation on aoes and just make it similar to fire ring aoe skill on offensive skill tree

Changing animations isn't quite so easy, because of how they all have been setup from the original development team. While we may not agree with how it is setup, changing it is by far, much more work with less benefit than the trouble is.

As you pointed out in my own response, the short of it is the core issue isn't so much the animation, than how the animations are handled. Until the specific bug can be identified and addressed, technically no animation is 'safe' to use. So changing them wouldn't really protect you any more than what's current.

We would prefer to find the issue itself so the animations can remain part of their current association to use.
 

I told leonis if its possible if we could use mp foods on CD, Since Mage would reach 43-44k Mp now (On max int gears) and its hard to regain mp with 1k mp pots alone. His reply was, mana shield isn't suppose to be spammed (something close to that). Mage are already having a hard time surviving in wars inside TG, and in TG mp food CAN BE USED. How much more on CD? Do i have to rely on Mana Flames? or do i need to sit in between wars so i could regain my MP?

And i agree with what you suggested. Either better MP pots (that is only useable on CD) or mp foods can be used.

I'll reiterate my position in regards to the use of Mana Shield. It is not intended to be a means to be constantly recast to sustain yourself defensively. It is a buffer, a means to help increase damage that can be taken, which in turn sustains the Mage longer than their natural life and defenses allow. Use the time wisely to escape, not stand toe to toe with a melee fighter.

Mages are squishy, it is intended. The Mana Shield extends the amount of damage they can take before it becoming fatal. Use that to your advantage as a tool to survive, not a crutch.
 

Its not about weak or strong. Mage still scary to me , but since mana brake and traps consumed crazy mp
I dont think mana flame can keep
Up with the mp regained . Maybe mp pots that gives 3k mp

Be cautious about ideal places for traps to be laid. Let your teammates go in first, or be a little more generous with using Mystic Eye.

Bonfire restores 3% MaxMP per 3 seconds.
Mana Flame restores 9% MaxMP per 3 seconds.

Mana Fissure offers a 100 MP Recovery (50 MP Recovery per stack, up to 2 stacks), for 30 seconds, if triggered from Water Mastery.

You can do the math on those for your character depending on how you have it setup. But the means to combat such heavy MP drain can incapacitate you if you are unprepared or simply don't have any means to recover.

Now, after this, it seems the idea of being able to recovery MP quickly for Mages might be a concern. We'll consider methods to allow for support in this, but for now, let us see how things unfold.
 


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#387 Ahya

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 07:28 PM

 

I'll reiterate my position in regards to the use of Mana Shield. It is not intended to be a means to be constantly recast to sustain yourself defensively. It is a buffer, a means to help increase damage that can be taken, which in turn sustains the Mage longer than their natural life and defenses allow. Use the time wisely to escape, not stand toe to toe with a melee fighter.

Mages are squishy, it is intended. The Mana Shield extends the amount of damage they can take before it becoming fatal. Use that to your advantage as a tool to survive, not a crutch.
 

 

Yes, exactly what it is. In CDs or wars, with even a very powerful Mana Shield that I've tried last time, it just doesn't create enough longevity to allow a mage to cast spells and kill off every one of his attackers, especially when he is ganged on by players, ranged or not. It's just a tool to survive. Personally, I've only casted Mana Shield every time a battle is about to start, in the middle of the battle where my most vital skills are on cooldown, or after a battle when my mana has already recovered fully. I rely my life on my teammates, and most especially the clerics who are focus healing me, all of whom I protect with my life.

 

A mage, with full defense gear, 2 clerics focus healing (the other 2 healing other mages) and with a powerful (Max  MP) Mana Shield can tank with 4 Mana Flames as defenders. The downside is, he only gets to AoE after every cast of Mana Shield, which wears down very easily, especially against an attacking team with so many champs AoE-ing on Berserk. I've already tried it, and immediately afterwards, I used the free reset to change builds.

 

However, in a scenario when your team is in a retreating move, recasting Mana Shield to fend off as much damage while moving is the most viable option. Multiple castings would allow a mage to reposition oneself in a favorable way. With this, I agree to the strengthening of MP pots and the allowance of MP food in CDs.


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#388 ChickenBucket

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:19 AM

have you guys tested the bourgs? i hvnt seen any bourg feedback D:


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#389 jerremy

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:24 AM

Tested cannon bourg for a little while, but really not to the extent where I can say much about it.

But I'll be short and say, the cannon bourg is like the physical damage version of the mage. Except that it loses to the mage in every aspect. Less CC, less damage (needs to crit all the time to be capable of doing the same damage), not as tanky (cause of mana shield), less movement speed, less escapes, a lot worse in 1v1 situations, ...


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#390 Bendersmom

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:45 AM

Was bourg even looked at this time?  Are there many changes to bourg?  It seems that the focus of this balance was mostly geared to raiders and mages to make them more powerful, scouts to add in the traps, and make clerics less tanky and not be able to spam heal anyone.  At least that was my take away.  I think we will find that once people figure out how to play a mage well they will be way OP (since good mages were pretty powerful before) and raiders will hurt like hell now.  I tests my bourg in Pegasus and didn't really see much of a difference.  My scout had fun with the traps.  And my cleric tried out a variety of things but was not able to test well in a CD.  

 

How long do you think until this is implemented?  I don't know about Draconis but Leonis is really slow at the moment.  A lot of players are taking a break or just log on to chat.  CDs do not go often.  I am hoping this update will bring more back to active.  Good or bad at least people will log on to try it out.  Let's try it out live and then fix/adjust things as needed.  The true tests will be farming/CDs/TG battles.


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#391 Bendersmom

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:46 AM

NVM, just saw it will be on the 13th!! 


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#392 jerremy

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:49 AM

Bourg only got a change to their buffs (jury rigging, dual layer, weapon augment, etc.). I did try my bourg for a while, and while they're not underpowered (pretty decent at the moment when played right), they lose to the mage quite heavily. 


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#393 Leonis

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 09:11 AM

The notes will be posted shortly. You'll see some writing regarding the feelings of lack of attention to some other classes. I'll comment here that in short, we only really attended to the classes we felt were falling short of their intended design and as we move forward with the improvements to ROSE, I'm sure we'll receive many suggestions and ideas on how to improve their class and game play. We are not finished, ROSE is an ever evolving world and we are doing what we can to keep advancing with it. It isn't all just about the skills either, there are other systems we need to "open up" so we can have more creative options for the future.

 

I'm locking down this thread for the time being. It has done its job. Thank you all for helping test on Pegasus. I'm very excited and looking forward to the update this Thursday, the 13th.

 

You can check out the full extent of the update here:

New Powers, New Friends, More Glory! March 13th Patch Notes v496
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