876 replies to this topic

[DestinyTalim]

Of course players aren't going to complain if you make aspects of the game easier for them. But then that leads to players wanting more and more aspects of the game to be easier to do. At what point do we stop catering to demands for an easy game and still keep it interesting enough for players to feel accomplished doing something?

 

Well they could make leveling as easy as it is on most RPG's, that way end game content is easier to do.  I'm not asking for it to be as easy as it is in Dragon's Dogma, where I can max my level out in 2 hours or less, but at least make it so I can solo and still get a level at 160+.  Also, I think they should add a Nameless Island, Cursed Monastery bounty board, or even a nightmare Nameless Island.

[DestinyTalim]

i'm saying to give people more options. the only way to get to max level in a reasonable amount of time is via bio4 boards. but not everyone can get into those parties because of biases/preconceived notions and what not. hence putting another high end bounty board for players to utilize makes it fairer for these people. it's not like people stop playing once they get to 175. max level isn't the goal of RO; that's when the game really begins.

 

I agree with this.  I was kicked out of a party MERELY for not having Temporal Dex Boots on my Rune KNIGHT, and she is capable of soloing there, albeit very slowly.

[DestinyTalim]

I don't understand why you're against having bounty boards in certain areas.  In theory, especially since the scripts are supposed to be easily copied for boards, there should eventually be boards for most all decent spawn rate monsters and most areas.  Since you already have bounty boards for most dungeons, there's not reason to not add them to their nightmare versions.  You want people to explore the world and level outside of gramps, so why not get boards for as many areas as possible? 

Gramps should have never been a permanent thing, but it is, and the damage is done.  But, for 150+ it's thankfully not an option.  This of course forces people to explore normal leveling areas.  However, as it is, most people are shoe-horned into the biolabs boards which essentially is the 151+ gramps, but with no variance in monsters and probably even more exclusivity on what classes are invited.  For those who aren't able to get into bio4 parties or just don't want to, there's not many other options, especially considering there's technically no true content for anyone much beyond 160. I think nightmare clocktower is the only place we currently have that has monsters going up to 170.  So, adding more 150+ bounty boards would give people more practical options.

As far as embs, I personally don't really care since I mainly do the boards for the extra exp.  So, I don't really have an opinion about that.  Telling people basically that if they want a quest system to include what they want they need to propose it themselves when a good system already exists that can be easily expanded seems a bit extreme.

I understand that this is a project that you spearheaded, but I don't understand why you're so dead set against adding certain monsters.  It doesn't change the core system, it only expands people's options on what they can hunt.

 

Such as me, as I refuse to make a mage build on a knight.  Though I wouldn't be able to do much with that character as they keep nerfing me, over and over again without warning.  I'm asking for Nameless Island, Cursed Monastery for other characters that can actually do some damage.

[DestinyTalim]

you're not understanding what's going on. the low demand classes have trouble getting into bio4 parties, which have a huge bonus with the inclusion of great bounty board awards. by not adding a bounty board for nightmare clock tower (an alternate spot these people could level at) they're being doubly punished (no bio4 party and no n. ct bb). adding a bounty board would absolutely help them get leveled up. these are not classes that are incapable of leveling on their own; they're just not taken along for bio4 because they're considered dead weight.

if bounty boards were supposed to be an alternate for gramps then the bio4 boards and mora boards wouldn't have been put in. almost everyone who uses them have already exceeded the gramps level requirement.

once again you haven't given a real reason why it's so difficult to add a new bounty board for this, as opposed to adding a completely new questing system. the new proposal is still in its infancy stages and won't be around for months. adding a new bounty board can be done before the anniversary exp bonus ends.

 

Like most of my non cookie cutter build characters.  Also I think orcs bounty board should have the level requirement lowered, like to level 30.

[Inubashiri]

Use multiquote please ~_~

[DarkGazer]

Can't wait for this to get locked again once there's been another major disagreement.

[DestinyTalim]

Everything is on hold until the pRO accounts issues are done so either way players would have to wait regardless. Unless you can convince the iRO team to put the pRO players on hold to address our issues first.

Players didn't have a problem dealing with Gramps until I came up with the Bounty Boards so players would have to deal with the unfinished Bounty Boards until Odd Jobs gets implemented. Questions about the Odd Jobs quest system can be posted on its appropriate thread.

 

Actually I did.  I only did it like 30 times in 3 years or so before bounties came out.  Already did more bounties than gramps in the 4 months I've played since they've been on.  One reason I'm asking for Nameless Island bounty is it is a high level area, but it's boring without anybody else there as the spawn rate is annoying since it's a big map, and there's nobody to make fun of when I kill faster with a healer than a killer:P

 

 

I take that back.  Back when he sent you to the real area where you actually had to avoid the MVP's or die, or have a good party, they were fun.  Now that it's a wanna be area with a bunch of bs, he sucks.  I've only done it 30 times or so, probably not even that, since then.

Edited by DestinyTalim, 14 July 2015 - 01:52 PM.

[DestinyTalim]

They were never a replacement for Gramps. I don't know where you got that idea. They were originally designed for people who hate Gramps.

 

I think they should replace him.  Gramps sucks and is making a lot of players forget how to play certain classes cause they are so easy.

Edited by DestinyTalim, 14 July 2015 - 01:45 PM.

[DestinyTalim]

Don't think you can use multiquote on pages that are 10 apart.  And how do I change the title?  I'm not a blogger at all, I think those are an utter waste of time.

Edited by DestinyTalim, 14 July 2015 - 01:41 PM.

[Akupuff]

Some BB's I'd like to see are:

 

-=Veins BB's= -

 

--75-110

Stapos, Magmarings, Muscipulars, Droseras

 

--120-150

Galions, Ragged Zombie, Zombie Slaughter, Knocker

 

--140-175

Banshee, Necromancer, Salamander, Kasa

 

-=Rachel=-

 

--75-110

Roween, Hill Wind, Desert Wolf, Siroma, Anacondaq

 

--120-150

Isilla, Vanberk, Ice Titan, Snowier

 

-=Nightmare Clock Tower=- (Might have to increase mob quantity on NCT2)

 

--150-175

Big Bell, Neo Punk, Big Ben 

 

 

ALSO

 

I was thinking of MVP BB's, and these 3 ideas came to mind:

 

- 3 count BB's: 24 hour cooldown, each on the entrance of the dungeon the MVP spawn in (except LoD, which would be in Nifflheim).

- ET BB's: 7 day cooldown, 1 of each of the MVP's that spawn there + Naght/Entweithen. Can only be accessed if you have the ET instance active. Would be at Misty Island.

- 1 of each MVP: A BB that demands 1 of each MVP (only Natural Spawns, no instance, no Bios). 36 hour cooldown.

 

These would award massive EXP, zeny and EMB, giving an alternative to MVP'ers and reward on hunting every MVP. I know this means more competition, but all the more rewarding when you win an MVP

 

...Yeah, yeah, I can see people QQ'ing about strong players hogging all the MVP's. :9 That's why I think ET BB's is the better of the 3.

Edited by Akupuff, 14 July 2015 - 01:54 PM.

[DestinyTalim]

Some BB's I'd like to see are:

 

-=Veins BB's= -

 

--75-110

Stapos, Magmarings, Muscipulars, Droseras

 

--120-150

Galions, Ragged Zombie, Zombie Slaughter, Knocker

 

--140-175

Banshee, Necromancer, Salamander, Kasa

 

-=Rachel=-

 

--75-110

Roween, Hill Wind, Desert Wolf, Siroma, Anacondaq

 

--120-150

Isilla, Vanberk, Ice Titan, Snowier

 

-=Nightmare Clock Tower=- (Might have to increase mob quantity on NCT2)

 

--150-175

Big Bell, Neo Punk, Big Ben 

 

 

ALSO

 

I was thinking of MVP BB's, and these 3 ideas came to mind:

 

- 3 count BB's: 24 hour cooldown, each on the entrance of the dungeon the MVP spawn in (except LoD, which would be in Nifflheim).

- ET BB's: 7 day cooldown, 1 of each of the MVP's that spawn there + Naght/Entweithen. Can only be accessed if you have the ET instance active. Would be at Misty Island.

- 1 of each MVP: A BB that demands 1 of each MVP (only Natural Spawns, no instance, no Bios). 36 hour cooldown.

 

These would award massive EXP, zeny and EMB, giving an alternative to MVP'ers and reward on hunting every MVP. I know this means more competition, but all the more rewarding when you win an MVP

 

...Yeah, yeah, I can see people QQ'ing about strong players hogging all the MVP's. :9 That's why I think ET BB's is the better of the 3.

 

Should be 110+ Zombie Slaughters, Ragged Zombies, Banshees, Flame Skulls, and Necromancers.

 

[Akupuff]

I think Banshees and Necros are in other level than the zombies, that's why I separated them. Flame Skulls I feel have too low of a spawn rate to ask to hunt 150 >.<

[DestinyTalim]

For Flame Skulls that's true, but banshees are actually a lower level than zombies, but they use the critical wound.  I think they should be all on the same one as when I was 105 on my ArchBishop, I was able to solo level 3 of the Cursed Monastery, so it would be possible.

[Akupuff]

Banshees are actually 6 levels higher than the zombies >< http://db.irowiki.or...nfo/nameless_n/

 

Also, with the new maps, hunting just Banshees can be super hard for some classes with all the Necromancers running around.

[DestinyTalim]

Then they changed banshees, they used to be 10 levels lower, and on the first map.  I know Nameless Island pretty well, zombies actually used to have almost 20k more hp than they do now, and Necromancers had over 150k.

[Talvis]

I agree with this.  I was kicked out of a party MERELY for not having Temporal Dex Boots on my Rune KNIGHT, and she is capable of soloing there, albeit very slowly.

I play a hybrid build RK and didn't have dex boots when I first started bio4 boards and never seemed to have any major negative comments, much less get kicked from a party.

 

I think they should replace him.  Gramps sucks and is making a lot of players forget how to play certain classes cause they are so easy.

Gramps, while a good way to level, especially for those who can't grind for hours on end, has had a relatively negative effect.  However, if you remove gramps without expanding the higher level bounty boards, you'll have a lot of pissed off people.  Bounty boards are good all around.  They give people a boost while leveling, encourage partying and unlike gramps, encourages people to explore the real game world and not some special instance.

[fuyukikun]

hello, i want to make monster suggestion.

prontera
111-140
creamy fear (53 spawn on valk GD1)
caterpillar (53 spawn on valk GD 1)
141-175
dark axe kobold (19 in valk GD 2, 32 on valk HoA)
dark mace kobold (34 in valk GD 2, 45 on valk HoA)
dark kobold archer (34 in valk GD 2, 45 on valk HoA)
dark hammer kobold (34 in valk GD 2, 45 on valk HoA)

morocc

101-130

anubis (23 in in_sphinx4)

nightmare verit (65 in moc_prydn1)

nightmare minorous (78 in moc_prydn1)
131-160
incarnation golem (79 in moc_fild21)
incarnation human (79 in moc_fild21)
incarnation angel (79 in moc_fild21)
incarnation ghost (58 in moc_fild21)

nightmare ancient mummy (23 in moc_prydn2)

nightmare mimic (35 in moc_prydn2)

nightmare arclouze (23 in moc_prydn2)

geffen
111-140
wraith dead (28 in Brit GD1)
zombie master (63 in brit GD1)

nightmare evild druid Canceled since the exp given is too small, not worth hunting

nightmare wraith Canceled since the exp given is too small, not worth hunting

nightmare mimic Canceled since the exp given is too small, not worth hunting
141-175
super dark priest (17 in Brit GD2, 20 in Brit HoA)
super dark frame (17 in Brit GD2, 20 in Brit HoA)
super dark shadow (51 in Brit GD2, 80 in Brit HoA)
nightmare wanderer (120 in nightmare GH)
nightmare rideword (40 in nightmare GH)

aldebaran
111-140
ancient worm (25 in Luina GD1)
giant spider (15 in Luina GD1)
giant hornet (30 in Luina GD1)
141-175
killer mantis (30 in Luina GD2, 64 in Luina HoA)
angra mantis (i suggest move it from mora since it spawns more in luina) (40 in Luina GD2, 74 in Luina HoA)

added today:

Big bell (225 in NCT3)

Neo Punk (55 in NCT2)

Big Ben (55 in NCT2)

payon
111-140
leib olmai (68 in Baldr GD1)
gullinbursti (37 in Baldr GD1)
141-175
am mut (18 in Baldr GD2, 32 in Baldr HoA)
gajomart (24 in Baldr GD2, 38 in Baldr HoA)
skeleton general (62 in Baldr GD2, 77 in Baldr HoA)

thank you

 

Necroing my post from long ago

[ZeroTigress]

^so you're basically saying there is no reason to ever implement 160+ boards because people would choose gramps if it was ever expanded? seeing as how the majority of the playerbase requested to not expand gramps beyond 150 in the first place, it's hard to take that as a legitimate reason.

you're also making a lot of assumptions about how people feel about bounty boards. where do you see "most players" hating them? I haven't seen any threads on the forums asking for bbs to go away, is this all word of mouth or are people coming onto raidcall to complain to you personally? people also use bounty boards at all levels; even after they can do gramps, plenty of people spam just the harpy boards to get to 99.

so no. people do not hate the bounty boards, and certainly "most players" do not feel this way.

There has been complaints about people leaving parties as soon as they finish their Bounty Board counts and not staying to help out others. And those against expanding Gramps past 150 have always been the minority, most people still prefer Gramps as it's a very efficient leveling system. Players do not want to grind longer than necessary if given the choice; this has been the status quo since 2011 when Gramps was first implemented and shows no signs of changing. Don't think people would still prefer Gramps TIs if given the choice? Just wait until they expand Gramps past 150 and all the activity you see on the world maps will be sucked back into Eden just like before; I have no doubts about that.

The very concept of a quest-based leveling system that rewards EXP in addition to money is an idea that iRO players have been against for years because it threatens RO's open world gameplay. They don't want RO to become another quest-based MMORPG like WoW and neither do I. Which is why the boards should just be limited to fields and basic dungeons, no more. This was never meant to be an extensive project that takes over the entire game.

People need to be straight up with their demands and simply admit the only reason they want Bounty Boards for nightmare dungeons is because they can't get EXP any other way because of the EXP penalty. Why else would there be such an aggressive campaign for it? People should be campaigning for the removal of the EXP penalty instead since that would do much more good for the game.

[Althes]

Hi Tigress, I am a solo player and after I hit 125+ I rarely went to TI anymore, instead I do BBs. I am thinking if it is possible to increase the kill count of some certain BBs monsters which have a very high spawn rate to like 300 or even 400. For example Centipede, I always finish the count within 5 minutes or so. But turning in and coming back to the map would take too long so I rather just leveling on the map with my BM3 until last 1 minute and teleport back to El Dicastes to turn in for the EXP. If the kill count increases it would be much more effective.

  The problem I could think of is if this idea practice and the workload to implement it would be very high. Anyway, I am just voicing my opinion.

[Necrohealiac]

There has been complaints about people leaving parties as soon as they finish their Bounty Board counts and not staying to help out others.

people have been leaving gramps parties midway since before bbs were ever implemented. I have never seen parties break up just because people are redeeming bounty boards. they'll just say "brb bounty board or TI" and then come back. people are most likely leaving for a multitude of other reasons.

And those against expanding Gramps past 150 have always been the minority, most people still prefer Gramps as it's a very efficient leveling system. Players do not want to grind longer than necessary if given the choice; this has been the status quo since 2011 when Gramps was first implemented and shows no signs of changing. Don't think people would still prefer Gramps TIs if given the choice? Just wait until they expand Gramps past 150 and all the activity you see on the world maps will be sucked back into Eden just like before; I have no doubts about that.

this is just false. when 175 level cap hit people were vocal early and often about making sure gramps was not expanded. the dissenters were in the minority. if the consensus of the playerbase was truly for expanding gramps then they should all be making themselves heard on the forums. since there hasn't been except random peeps sometimes on a tiki tues stream or thread, I'm going to have to say i'll believe it when I see it.

The very concept of a quest-based leveling system that rewards EXP in addition to money is an idea that iRO players have been against for years because it threatens RO's open world gameplay. They don't want RO to become another quest-based MMORPG like WoW and neither do I. Which is why the boards should just be limited to fields and basic dungeons, no more. This was never meant to be an extensive project that takes over the entire game.

People need to be straight up with their demands and simply admit the only reason they want Bounty Boards for nightmare dungeons is because they can't get EXP any other way because of the EXP penalty. Why else would there be such an aggressive campaign for it? People should be campaigning for the removal of the EXP penalty instead since that would do much more good for the game.

removing the exp penalty is way more trouble than it's worth. the amount of exp certain monsters give compared to their hp will make it ridiculously easy to get to max level. you'll have people just farming in places like nogg road to 175 due to mob density, ease of monsters, and exp given. this will require a MASSIVE rebalancing of all the exp tables across the board. this isn't something as simple as removing the drop penalty.

if bounty boards were supposed to get people out of gramps and into the world, removing exp penalty without changing how much monsters give will just make it so the entire server will be hanging out on a handful of maps.

[Victorh3x3]

The problem about removing the exp penalty is that the diference beetween well geared players leveling and the new ones are going to increase even more, the system right now balance so that well geared and new ones go to the same level spot and work together for leveling faster. If this goes down we will se a bunch of Tao RK going scaraba lv 100, or geneticist one shoting bio mobs with AD. The whole game is balanced this way, removing the penalty means altering the whole game. The biggest problem is that the 175 patch came with nowhere to level, now we have bio4 but is usually locked to a few key classes and only supports a certain type of build. The Nightmare Clock Tower, even thou is a good place 150+, it isn't suitable anymore when you get to 165+, so people get locked about options for leveling. Besides, you need to use much more consumables and xp manuals for making the level there to work, so its positive for the market. The bounty could help these kinds of people who aren't accepted in bio4 a way to achieve 175. We are not asking to be the same exp as bio4 but at least give us options for 175.

[Akupuff]

The Nightmare Clock Tower, even thou is a good place 150+, it isn't suitable anymore when you get to 165+, so people get locked about options for leveling.

 

Well, I disagree on this. Big Bells still give nice experience, even at 174. It's definitively a good place to grind. Though, not all classes faire the same. 

[Ahrounwarrior]

My suggestion is that all boards should have a nightmare mode, and someone already suggested this, but would be nice to have MVP BB, with a instant teleport to the map of that mvp, and this map should be instanced for you or your party.

[Ahrounwarrior]

My suggestion is that all boards should have a nightmare mode, and someone already suggested this, but would be nice to have MVP BB, with a instant teleport to the map of that mvp, and this map should be instanced for you or your party.

Ohh this ctrl+c and ctrl+v kill me some times lol

[Toxn]

They don't want RO to become another quest-based MMORPG like WoW and neither do I.

 

Future content will be a nightmare for you then. Because that is the direction RO is sailing. :v

Edited by Toxn, 15 July 2015 - 12:00 PM.