141 replies to this topic

[Calliou05]

They should've left absorb how it was in my opinion, It was already easy killing a mage.. now it takes no effort at all. 

[KatsuraKujo]

Now i wouldn't say "no effort" but effort was definitely needed to kill mages before this. Now its kinda a little too simple? Still tricky depending on who you're trying to kill actually.

 

Then again my raider sucks and the few AA i went with em, ended up with a grp of no teamworking people... At least now there's some teamwork going on... meh

[johniscu]

They should've left absorb how it was in my opinion, It was already easy killing a mage.. now it takes no effort at all. 

They sure did jump the gun on this one huh

[Leeny]

Mages are fine, all you need is very good teamwork to defeat the opposing team aht's full of mages.

[kwayan19]

so i played AA

 

 

if he didn't have dedicated clerics (clannies) ressing him everytime he would spend the whole AA coming back and forth the spawn..

 

aoe once or twice then dead respawn.. rinse repeat so fuuuuun.

 

@johniscu sorry i used you as an example hehehe

Edited by kwayan19, 05 June 2015 - 01:33 AM.

[johniscu]

so i played AA

 

 

if he didn't have dedicated clerics (clannies) ressing him everytime he would spend the whole AA coming back and forth the spawn..

 

aoe once or twice then dead respawn.. rinse repeat so fuuuuun.

 

@johniscu sorry i used you as an example hehehe

WOOHOO IM FAMOUS

[Ramesses]

First of all sorry for my late reply.

i thought i'd wait for some of the devs or anyone of the Admins to give us their input and as expected totally ignored.

just because the majority of the players are Katars; everyone trys to subtlety avoid the topic that they are way over powered.

everyone got a raider thats why they think its "fair"

Mage is rubbish now.. first thing said in Arenas "Get the mage" whoever that is. and good luck tanking all these raiders or use manashield with that crit lock.. OR that sleep that lasts forever which you are dead as well imagine if theres only two raiders each one with a stun and a sleep

you are dead.. which isnt the case since all raiders just gang you.

 

I posted before the latest update and will again here.  The mage was fine and should have been left alone.  From a healing clerics point of view I had to heal the mages at about the same rate as the other fighters now.  Before you could not keep a mage alive even with 2 FS clerics focusing on them.  The new mana shield stuff actually made them playable again.  They were still able to be killed, it just took a bit more work, and I mean bit.  I have no idea where people were saying they were impossible to kill.  Did they survive longer than before? yes, but that was the point.  Before they might as well have committed suicide to try to die any faster.  The mage was horrible to play before that mana shield and all update.  I know a lot of really good mages who didn't even bother playing. 

 

Unfortunately the fact that mages were not simple kills anymore and some people had to actually use strategy, they came on and complained that mages were unkillable so they were nerfed.  The nerf was not needed.  If anything had to be done maybe lowering the mana shield from 100% to maybe 80% would have been fine.  But to also take away their MP it makes the skills stupid now.  Mages were easy to stop, but like I said it took a bit more work.  Stuns, sleeps, mutes, and just a bourg hammering on them was enough.  

 

Not talking about other classes here, this is a thread about mages and mana shield.  It should stay that way.  

 

thank you first of all Leigh for saying the truth but you have seen me through this before devs will never do anything because 

A: they cannot upset the majority of the players.

B: none of them actually plays the game in combat.

so all that is left to do is just say what we think here and hope for some just..

 

I haven't played since the updated but the real problem is likely that overall damage is so high. This, combined with a weak manashield results in mages dieing before they can accomplish anything. 

exactly.. they are targeted just because.. nothing else.

i cannot even enjoy the game anymore.. my 2h is crap and so is my mage if i dont have a team that outnumbers the other team.. which isnt fun still.

i hope they can see it.

 

We have active Class Rep's for mage?

 

NO WE DON'T and even if he/she is they will side with the devs.

 

Sure with 2 to 3 fs always backing you up and them fancy clan skills... I see no set back on your part

LOL

 

nah, raiders's critical lock neds to be nerfed. is not right to land a critical blow with 180% crit damage.. thats like 4 hits on mage and dead,,,, less than 2 seconds exactly. i play raider only have glory and aura set with atack speed. i still do 15 + kill every AA game. cause I mainly target muse class and dealers than i go for soldier class., they can's take my crit lock and crit damage ... yes I hope they nerf raider class. so we can see more variety on the game arena . not just all the way hawker class ... 

well said man.

 

Bourgs has higher def than mages.. i saw some comment in another thread that they are 2nd to the soldier class in terms of def.. the good thing about them is their range.. they can nuke from afar.

Sure mages have range/target skills but its still too close... sure they can learn passives to increase their range,once you have range you have puny damage output.. unlike bourgs they can get evrything... mages has alot of sp wasting skills.. younhave to sacrifice this and that to get one thing.. imo muse class has the most sp wasting skills....

Dont misunderstood me I like launcher bourgs right now.. its fun playing it

that sounds like someone who actually tried how hard to adjust a mage!

 

Fortified manashield is changed to 75 percent. Not 70

 

The mp consumption is not 30 percent but only 14 percent. That 30 percent IS WITHOUT THE MP CONSUMPTION from the skills and items. There are mp consumption passives and substat from the sh itself and IT WILL LOWER THE MP COST OF FORTIFIED MANASHIELD. so after the mp consumption passives and from the items that 30 percent will be lowered and can go to 14 percent if you get max mp consumption passives.

 

Ill borrow katsura's picture on his mage.

 

Total mp 27490. Mp cost to recast:3848

 

How many manashields do you think is that? is it 3? is it 5? obviously No

 

thank you for sharing your setup mate.

still its not good in my opinion, and if you think this is a good build.. try again.

 

 

Well, I'm still here... Somewhat absent, but still alive... Trying to return to be active both in the forum and in the game... But I'm still helping some newbies Mage in the game...

 

Well, I honestly haven't tested the change of Mana Shield in PvP, but I did not feel any difference in PvM... However, I don't have full MP in my Mage, and have yet to test this in both PvP and PvM before you can decide which I'll keep...

 

But please, don't start to talk that Mage was completely nerfed or unusable... We all know that every update a class is OP and another is Nerfed... Currently I see countless Raiders in PvP, but I must admit I've seen more last month... The same way I've ever seen CD games with 7 or 8 Mages per team in the past  and I really don't want to go back at that time...

 

thank you for coming by the topic but as expected.. you ofc side with the devs. probably you still got a raider than you can use.

and i hope i didnt vote for you to be my mage rep.

 

WILL SOMEONE PLEASE!!!!! 

do us just and balance the game or the class.. up to you just try and actually play the class IN GAME!

[pdfisher]

NO WE DON'T and even if he/she is they will side with the devs.

 

 

This is not true. I can personally attest that we class reps do NOT always agree with the devs. We give them our input, and it is up to them whether they listen or not. Right now the class balancing has been put on hold to deal with server merge issues. Hopefully it will soon be taken back up and they will finish this. I would like for them to move on and deal with other problems in Rose.

[WorldDestroyerxx]

RamessesII i always see you at tg crying about the raiders when you pvp them.. you ask raiders to pvp you then if you lost you say raiders op. if your talkin about 1 v 1, ur mage clanmate can beat katars in 1 v 1 fight. It all depends in the build. maybe you can ask him so he give his build to you to stop cryin about this.

 

Katsura posted the pic not to showcase his build but to show you that the mp consumption is only 14 percent. not 40, not 30 and not 15. read again.

 

If you sayin mage are unplayable tell that to ur (pvp) thunderstorm aoe stun at 3 seconds. Not to mention wind type has another spammble stun not to mention getting the staff stun and can still get the full manashield

 

 

Stop crying and blaming the devs for crying out loud. If people don't side against you, you assume he is a katar raider even he is a mage rep. Like srsly

Edited by WorldDestroyerxx, 15 June 2015 - 06:08 AM.

[Ramesses]

This is not true. I can personally attest that we class reps do NOT always agree with the devs. We give them our input, and it is up to them whether they listen or not. Right now the class balancing has been put on hold to deal with server merge issues. Hopefully it will soon be taken back up and they will finish this. I would like for them to move on and deal with other problems in Rose.

i hope so.

 

Ram i always see you in game crying about the raiders when you pvp them.. your clanmate which is also a mage beats katar 1 v 1. maybe you can ask his build. Stop crying my goodness

i don't appreciate that you come here to flame.

you are welcome to post here but do not come here out of jealousy and start to flame.

[WorldDestroyerxx]

If you don't want people to flame you dont make biased assumptions that say when people don't agree with ur opinion you assume he is a katar raider lol. You didnt even read what katsura said. It is not to showcase the build but a point on the mp consumption argument. A person who can't even read other's opinions and is full of biased assumptions is no different from what you proclaim the devs to be

Edited by WorldDestroyerxx, 15 June 2015 - 06:14 AM.

[Ramesses]

If you don't want people to flame you dont make biased assumptions that say when people don't agree with ur opinion you assume he is a katar raider lol. You didnt even read what katsura said. It is not to showcase the build but a point on the mp consumption argument. A person who can't even read other's opinions and is full of biased assumptions is no different from what you proclaim the devs to be

since you are admitting coming here to flame please dont do that.

and its not biased..,  and i wont stoop to your argument because i know what you are.. Jealous.

[pdfisher]

Ok, will you two please take this to private PMs? This does not belong here.

[kwayan19]

ive said this before with many of my friends mages are still the same build around it my mage hasnt taken not even a step back after this update..

 

sincerely, Worldmage

 

 

 

 

* And I saw you saying worldmage does not play competitive mage games. FYI, he is one of the mages that tops aa most of the time. Stop saying people don't know how to play mages and they don't play competitive games. These are good mages. You don't need to resort to criticize other people's builds and skill just to prove your point

 

 

Mages are damn near impossible to play rite now so id like to see that data from mana shield nerf up to a month and see how drastically it changes.

 

 

GG.. your argument worlddestroyer?

Edited by kwayan19, 16 June 2015 - 01:39 AM.

[Ramesses]

Ok, will you two please take this to private PMs? This does not belong here.

 

thank you for your input.

 

 

 

 

GG.. your argument worlddestroyer?

 

i didn't comment on that screenshot first time i saw it because i can never make one game a standard for how the class is.

i got a screenshot with a score that beats his, but because i got lucky doesn't mean that the class is fine.

and i would like to think of myself that i know the class and i can play it well too.

Edited by Ramesses, 16 June 2015 - 01:17 PM.

[borgahutt]

thank you for your input.
i didn't comment on that screenshot first time i saw it because i can never make one game a standard for how the class is.
i got a screenshot with a score that beats his, but because i got lucky doesn't mean that the class is fine.
and i would like to think of myself that i know the class and i can play it well too.

Very true - just because of one game it doesn't mean anything, I've had 2.5m damage and more kills than that, that doesn't mean anything

To be honest I don't think mages are too bad as they are , before they were high damage output and could tank quite a bit - yes it was fun but it's better as it is now, like most classes I think it's how you play the character , it's not hard on a Mage to just spam aoe skills and you knock a few people off - and have a cleric to spam res you, I've noticed some good mages that position and use specific skills in certain situations and not just spam away

[CharasX]

In all honesty. Mages are very bad as they are!

 

This is a very very powerfull class... the amount of CC (crowd control) skill they have access to is very high... and their AOE damage input is absolutly insane.

The only thing that makes it bearable is the fact Mages are only few (for now... because I see new mages popping out of nowhere everyday)... But now.. imagine arena games where a team would have let s say as many Mages as their oponents would have Raiders... (because it s the most populated class)... what would happen? perma stun 1 shot aoe fights.

 

Ever experienced fights were 3 Mages or more were in the same team? well... there s not something nice to see. lol

 

The mana shield nerf was a total dumb move... what mages needed was a nerf on their aoe dmg output... or on their CCs... but not on their survivability.

 

In the original ROSE design... mages was an very heavy CC class... with many spammable aoes... but dealing only low damage! to defeat their oponent they were able to chain stun... and there was a reason for this set up!

 

I do expect Mages user to criticize my post a lot... but in the end of the day... I m very sure I'm right.

 

Edited by CharasX, 17 June 2015 - 08:24 AM.

[johniscu]

Very true - just because of one game it doesn't mean anything, I've had 2.5m damage and more kills than that, that doesn't mean anything

To be honest I don't think mages are too bad as they are , before they were high damage output and could tank quite a bit - yes it was fun but it's better as it is now, like most classes I think it's how you play the character , it's not hard on a Mage to just spam aoe skills and you knock a few people off - and have a cleric to spam res you, I've noticed some good mages that position and use specific skills in certain situations and not just spam away

You do realize that screenshot is deaths not kills

[iMatt]

tbh who cares about deaths - all that counts is win or not...if i have to die 50 times but my side wins i m still happy...

[CharasX]

The only reason why mages are dieing so much is because they represent the higher threat in the opposing team. Mages are always the first targets.... always.

 

So in fact... if one day Mages are able to go through a whole game without being target once then it will be the day when Mages user will be able to say their class is definitly underpowered, until then... I only see a bunch of players whining because they play a class that is so powerfull that everyone wants to kill them as fast as possible.

 

 

And the exact same logic works with the cleric class... but it s offtopic!

=D

[carlosrose]

Ever experienced fights were 3 Mages or more were in the same team? well... there s not something nice to see. lol

 

 

And how about being all the other way around? Have you ever experienced 3 raiders hitting you? (of course on a character without cloak) Defenetly not something nice to see when u can get stun and critical locked to death. 

 

The reason why spear champs, mages, launcher bourgs are targeted first is bcoz they can inflict a huge amount of dmg in few skills and they have no dodge neither they have the ability to cloak, making it easy for those stealth classes to gang up on them with their high aspeed. And the same go for clerics, they provide support for the group therefore is a common tactic to take them out first.

 

That a job is targeted first doesnt mean its OP or UP, it means they represent a thread or can be game changing if they are allowed to perform freely. 

[CharasX]

And how about being all the other way around? Have you ever experienced 3 raiders hitting you? (of course on a character without cloak) Defenetly not something nice to see when u can get stun and critical locked to death. 

 

The reason why spear champs, mages, launcher bourgs are targeted first is bcoz they can inflict a huge amount of dmg in few skills and they have no dodge neither they have the ability to cloak, making it easy for those stealth classes to gang up on them with their high aspeed. And the same go for clerics, they provide support for the group therefore is a common tactic to take them out first.

 

That a job is targeted first doesnt mean its OP or UP, it means they represent a thread or can be game changing if they are allowed to perform freely. 

 

3 raiders can destroy 1 target, 3 mages can destroy the whole team.

 

enough said.

[carlosrose]

3 raiders can destroy 1 target, 3 mages can destroy the whole team.

 

enough said.

 

Mage strengh relies on their aoes, raiders strengh come with their high DPS and MULTIPLE survival mechanisms

 

Different jobs, different weakness and strenghs. Stop claiming that mages aoes are op, launcher aoes are far superior thanks to their high critical and spear champs can do even better when played properly. Deal with it, you arent suppose to survive 3 mages aoeing the same way mage (or any other job, except maybe knight) is suppose to survive 3 raiders.

[CharasX]

You did not read my posts it seems. This is not their overall damages alone that make this class really really strong... but the fact they got access to very powerfull crowed control skills too. And btw... even talking about single target damage... no raider would survive 3 mages using single target skill on them.

 

But once again.... nice try I nearly felt sad for Mages!

[Ramesses]

Mages.. huh

 

always a raider that hates the mage class because what? AOEs?

why do you think most of the raider players choose that class? and if someone is honest it would go like this.. cloak, dodge, crit and attack speed.

the most agile character like some said an "Assassin" and i agree. but why does raiders get to go stealth and mages cannot? and we are talking about the magician class here that uses magic which by all fairness if there is the ability of cloaking that exists it should go to them.., but no raiders has it.

only defense mechanism is the manashield and works on the same defense that your character has. 

what most raiders dont know those who havent played mage recently is that mages are too much work not just select set back and watch. like some other classes. if we were both to lag.. it will be an advantage to raider his "auto-attack" will prevail whilst the mage cannot skill during a lag.

i might think it would be fair for a mage to be what they are now like some others said its the way you play mage because that is true, i am sometime able to have a fair game but thats when we have a better team than the others.

mages got elements now for each skill tree and i love the idea that every mage if they want to be good they got to pick a certain element to make it their type.

but the lack of sp due to like what someone said for the too much passives that you need to get it forces your hand on either picking a defense side or an offense side, and if you were to balance you couldnt have both because simply it is not balanced.

i see "charasX" took it upon himself to defend raiders and attack mages. trying to make a case against the 3 raiders which is the least to target a mage which a mage couldnt survive and btw i think 3 raiders are way too much.. two can do the job now or even one anyway; CharasX you forgot to mention the amount of dodge raiders are allowed to have now with the changes that came to the pvp honor sets.. mages hit 1 out of 5 skills whilst you will never miss on him and you dont need that much of accuracy anyway. but for mages even with the highest INT that you can have and the passive that gives you accuracy out of INT i never have enough accuracy to kill a raider now..

i would respect your argument more if you actually knew what you were talking about.