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Renewal WoE Revitalization Project


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#226 Mulder1

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 03:57 PM

Mhm and stasis staying for 30s when it was supposed to stay for 12 is correct ok. Stop with the acting and inciting drama as well ok? thx

 

Btw... I didn't want to do it but since I'm done uploading my video... why not?

 

Math 101:

 

Suppose to stay 12 = 12 seconds stasis; Stasis Level = 5

 

12 = 5 (fixed) + [Skill Level * 5 - ((VIT+DEX)/20) ]

 

=> 7 = [Skill Level * 5 - ((VIT+DEX)/20) ]  =>  (VIT + DEX) / 20 = 18  =>  VIT + DEX = 360

 

Wow... should I assume that you have a combination of VIT + DEX of 360 points?? perhaps math is not your forte isn't?

 

Anyway, just that... I think it would be safest to test it as well... like I did before =)


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#227 Ashuckel

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:01 PM

Stop with the acting and inciting drama as well ok? thx

I was expecting too much, ofc not gonna happen


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#228 meli

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:02 PM

So ignoring the obvious baits.

 

Is it possible to make skills not go through walls? this alone would be helpful.


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#229 Mulder1

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:04 PM

Btw... I didn't want to do it but since I'm done uploading my video... why not?

 

Math 101:

 

Suppose to stay 12 = 12 seconds stasis; Stasis Level = 5

 

12 = 5 (fixed) + [Skill Level * 5 - ((VIT+DEX)/20) ]

 

=> 7 = [Skill Level * 5 - ((VIT+DEX)/20) ]  =>  (VIT + DEX) / 20 = 18  =>  VIT + DEX = 360

 

Wow... should I assume that you have a combination of VIT + DEX of 360 points?? perhaps math is not your forte isn't?

 

Anyway, just that... I think it would be safest to test it as well... like I did before =)

 

Just stating the facts. I mean, if we don't know how a skill works, is better to test it prior commenting about it right? Data is always needed prior stating a fact. (just like when running a protocol >_<)

 

 

So ignoring the obvious baits.

 

Is it possible to make skills not go through walls? this alone would be helpful.

 

 

Yes, that would be the best way to approach this issue... I believe kRO already has this fix? Back when balance patch was being tested, Stasis didn't go through walls and AoE was reduced to 15x15 if I remember correctly.

 

What happen to that change, I have no idea but I do believe we did test that.

 

If Stasis is changed, perhaps we should look into the other skills that works same way such as Frost Joke and Howling.


Edited by Mulder1, 08 May 2016 - 04:06 PM.

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#230 sheepmia

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:27 PM

Man I don't know when did you test it but stasis dose last 30 regardless of whatever

oOGKWF6.png

on me.

 

Again if they don't implement KRO fix first (taking forever) and decide to alter skills solely based on some player requests, it's like a pserver and it's gonna get bad.


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#231 Mayhem

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:33 PM

Why no one upvote my genius universal easy fix formula???

 

all we need to make woe alive is this formula on all damage instances calculation.

 

If 90% of target max hp - final damage = 0 or lower , then target will loss 90% of max hp.

 

better than sarah card or proposed change, no card slot and armor needed, server sided.

 

See, all just -_-ing hypocrite, you dont want to die but you want your enemy to die. You complain when you got one shotted but you laugh when you one shot. LMFAO.

 

Because that would have to apply to every time they damaged you.

If my character has 10000 HP

First hit takes 90% of your hp. Leaving you with 1000 left.

Next hit Takes 90% of your hp, Leaving you with 100 left

And lets hope then 10 hp

The 1 hp

and finally on the fifth attack killed him.

 

That would be rediculous. There wouldnt be a way to make it happen to just the first skill and would be unfair for it to be applied to only some skills.

 

-------------------------------

 

 

ON the "skills over wall" talk:

If a skill is screen wide - Canto-howling-frost joke - then it shouldnt be effected by your talk.

 

Skills that have to be cast on a cell, that never should have been able to go across the wall - Stasis - Should be included in the talk. Nevermind got it confused with another skill

 

Skills that have to be cast on a cell, that never should have been able to go across the wall.Should be included in the talk if there are any.

 

 

'really if a skill is screen wide, then thats just another part of woe. We shouldnt nerf everything that ends in a status effect. Or how would you defend your castles as everyone can just run past you..... There has to be status effects in game, we have already lost enough

-------------------------------

 

I have to say the idea of about limiting what can go into Woe is a bad idea and should just not even have been said. You know nothing like that will ever happen. That would be like them telling you that you cant play your character in woe. It wont happen and we shouldnt even bring that up

 

 


Edited by Mayhem, 08 May 2016 - 05:12 PM.

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#232 Ashuckel

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 04:55 PM

Because that would have to apply to every time they damaged you.

If my character has 10000 HP

First hit takes 90% of your hp. Leaving you with 1000 left.

Next hit Takes 90% of your hp, Leaving you with 100 left

And lets hope then 10 hp

The 1 hp

and finally on the fifth attack killed him.

 

That would be rediculous. There wouldnt be a way to make it happen to just the first skill and would be unfair for it to be applied to only some skills.

 

-------------------------------

RO actually would round the lst hit down to 0, and the person would never die :v


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#233 Mulder1

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:04 PM

Because that would have to apply to every time they damaged you.

If my character has 10000 HP

First hit takes 90% of your hp. Leaving you with 1000 left.

Next hit Takes 90% of your hp, Leaving you with 100 left

And lets hope then 10 hp

The 1 hp

and finally on the fifth attack killed him.

 

That would be rediculous. There wouldnt be a way to make it happen to just the first skill and would be unfair for it to be applied to only some skills.

 

-------------------------------

 

 

ON the "skills over wall" talk:

If a skill is screen wide - Canto-howling-frost joke - then it shouldnt be effected by your talk.

 

Skills that have to be cast on a cell, that never should have been able to go across the wall - Stasis - Should be included in the talk.

 

'Is a statis nerf really the only idea thats left for people to give camp?"

-------------------------------

 

I have to say the idea of about limiting what can go into Woe is a bad idea and should just not even have been said. You know nothing like that will ever happen. That would be like them telling you that you cant play your character in woe. It wont happen and we shouldnt even bring that up

 

Stasis is a screen wide skill.


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#234 Mayhem

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:07 PM

Stasis is a screen wide skill.

 

Oh I was confusing it with that other skill. Oh then screw that, it should be screen wide then. Its just another part of the game that you have to fight your way through. If nothing can stop a guild diving into a castle then woe would be pointless.


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#235 ChakriGuard

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:08 PM

<>

 

VModCinnamon:

User's posting privileges have been revoked.


Edited by VModCinnamon, 08 May 2016 - 05:28 PM.
Mod notice.

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#236 Mulder1

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:11 PM

Oh I was confusing it with that other skill. Oh then screw that, it should be screen wide then. Its just another part of the game that you have to fight your way through. If nothing can stop a guild diving into a castle then woe would be pointless.

 

I don't like the skill but that's how it works. Yeh... I believe is part of the game?


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#237 Mayhem

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:14 PM

<>

 

^while trying to bait others with passive aggressiveness.

 

----------------------

 

Camp you going to update the first post with some of this stuff? we are at 10 pages already.
 


Edited by VModCinnamon, 08 May 2016 - 05:29 PM.
Edited in quote

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#238 Mayhem

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:20 PM

Look into changes to guardians have same effects as plant type monsters create more usefulness of them
 

 

holy crap I love this!!!!!!

Maybe up the damage also of them in woe.

Would be so interesting to have them actually be part of woe again.

 

 

(and who is Haseo on the forums? have him pm me)


Edited by Mayhem, 08 May 2016 - 05:20 PM.

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#239 VModCinnamon

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:40 PM

Feels like Stasis needs it own discussion thread. Any more input about the other presented ideas in first post?


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#240 Hissis

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:43 PM

Feels like Stasis needs it own discussion thread. Any more input about the other presented ideas in first post?

 

I still think a balance patch for GOH/TC/maybe no limits is more important than stasis :v

 

We just need to get that stasis fix from kRO (and maybe 7748798455151 skill buf fixes)


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#241 miliardo

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:48 PM

Feels like Stasis needs it own discussion thread. Any more input about the other presented ideas in first post?



I think it's been argued enough fix over the wall and leave rest of skill alone for now
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#242 PervySageMarty

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:50 PM

<>

 

VModCinnamon:

User's posting privileges have been revoked.

 

Welp.....


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#243 Undying

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:52 PM

I think it's been argued enough fix over the wall and leave rest of skill alone for now

 

^ Agreed 100%. That is the general consensus from the past 10 pages. 


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#244 Demeris

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 05:54 PM

Feels like Stasis needs it own discussion thread. Any more input about the other presented ideas in first post?

No need, here's already a thread discussing it https://forums.warpp.../page-2?hl= can

Notice: same childish bickering

Edited by Demeris, 08 May 2016 - 06:14 PM.

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#245 miliardo

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 06:26 PM

No need, here's already a thread discussing it https://forums.warpp.../page-2?hl= can

Notice: same childish bickering



There are very few people who woe and are active in forums is why. Every time these kind of threads gets made there is a lot of differences in opinions. As haseo been saying the idea is to get to root of problem and not stick a bandaid on it. This thread has been better then most.
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#246 s3nd0

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 07:50 PM

Regarding to the Campitor's "proposed changes" & after reading most of the relies...After years of stating that the iRO team have insufficient authority to make structural changes to WoE without kRO's approval but suddenly being able to proposed such fundamental changes...It just made me puzzled and leads me take it as some kinds of conspiracy haha.

 

Anyway the game is actually balanced given the fact that there is up&down sides for most class/skill/gear/build but it could be better if...
- Disable all over-wall skill effects (stasis/howl/frostjoke/etc), Walls or obstacles are meant to be there for a reason to take cover lol unless we can have a clear and visible definition of which kinds of walls that could be cast through.

- Disable Mechanic from wearing Dex Boots and allow the cast to be interrupted.

- Lower the damage increase of No Limit.

- Add a 0.2 global cooldown on every Masq attempt so it can not be spammed rapidly.

- Nerf Sura by abit in either Mobility or Damage.
 

*Yes/No for disabling Alliance since it wont make much of a difference as people still have ways around to work together.

*Yes for restoring WoE1 castle with specific god pieces.

*No for disabling dual-client, same reason as above and it will piss off everyone that PVM.

*No for adding global cooldown on all skills since its completely meaningless and kill the game straight away. Strings/Kiels/GX/DB-RK/Chasers/all spamming class can just quit playing and all 1-hit/high dmg class gets everything.

 

As for the cooldown on Pot, why dont iRO just develop a official Autopot-like software for people to subscribe to use so there will be a standard of how fast you should pot no matter if someone using macro mouse or not. People with Macro could set to meet with the standard, and GM can identify who cheat with autopot and ban them officially. 

 


Edited by s3nd0, 08 May 2016 - 07:52 PM.

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#247 995150831045349567

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 08:33 PM

1) The idea of "Emperium Shards" is actually pretty interesting, but sadly, it has some issues

  • The quest to kill the emperium would put non-aspd classes (non-breakers) at disadvantage regarding the collection of shards. A huge disadvantage since you specified "This quest would give a large amount of emperium shards. When turned in".
  • If the emperium shards get scattered around the mentioned parts of the castle, some players could abuse that and collect more than other guildmates by taking advantage of the circunstances (for example, during the breaking, the enemies -the ones holding the castle- were attacking the intruding guild and killed some of its members; suddenly, the emp got broken and the shards got scattered. The players who couldn't survive the enemy rush would have to get back in, and while they're on it, the rest of the players already cleaned the floor).
  • The new equipments don't sound that promising to many players because they jeopardize the need of specific gears in order to survive, inflict a decent amount of damage, or avoid statuses. Instead they would be useful to certain classes or builds (and playstyles) that focus on debuffing, and new players that can't afford high-end or even mid-end gears and are more prone to perishing in battle; So, a guild as a whole wouldn't be that motivated to destroy emperiums just to get shards (which doesn't help your goal: "Increase Participation and Breaking of Castles").
  • To counter the previous points, the idea of a NPC that appears once the castle gets taken (emperium breaks) and gives out shards to each player is actually better, because even non-breakers and classes/players that can't tank that much and die before the emp gets broken would have an equal chance to get shards (assuming they'd want them; this has something to do with the next point). It was already mentioned by someone in this thread, just retaking it.
  • If the rewards given by turning shards in were to get better (A LOT better), guilds attacking random ocastles just to farm them would become a common occurence. There's got to be a mid-point to avoid this and avoid indifference towards shards, but I can't think of anything right now; maybe making the mentioned gears available (if someone wants/needs them because of reason "x", they'll be there) but adding buffing scrolls or something in order to attract players that don't.

2) WoE Bounty Tokens are conflicting too:

  • Tokens earned for killing players near your character level seem okay, it's only natural to kill during WoE (obviously), and on top of that you get rewarded? Great. BUUUT the only ones who will actually get any benefit out of it are killers, and that's unfair towards support classes/players. Like, they have to help you survive and kill, but since they can't kill by themselves they get nothing out of a TEAM-EFFORT?
  • The same goes for the tokens earned by destroying barricades, guardians, and stones; non-dps and non-aspd players (A.K.A. support players -maybe leaving Maestros out of the "non-aspd" classification because of the Berserk Guitar effect-) don't stand a chance to earn any reward.
  • If support players can't get access to the rewards you get by turning tokens in BECAUSE THEY DON'T GET TOKENS AT ALL, what's the point?
  • The reward system seems okay itself, you just have to change the mechanics (a lot lol). The bounty (killing, destroying) rewards should be aimed towards the guild because at the end of the day it is actually the guild as the sum of its parts that gets the job done. I mean, instead of rewarding individual players reward the guild in a way that it rewards its players equaly. For example, when WoE ends the recaller would have to talk to an NPC (available in any realm) that gives him an X amount of weightless tokens based on the guild's performance (the bounties), which can be used the next WoE to protect castles or something (not quite sure about the usefulness of the tokens for a guild at WoE. Would have to look further into it); this could help to destroy opportunistic guilds that only break empty castles and avoid battles because they're only interested in farming Godly pieces/items.

3) Destroying formal guild alliances seems fine, because WoE would become more challenging. And since guilds can still be allied (just not in the same way) and merges are still possible, small guilds have the chance to merge with others (let it be temporary or permanent, whatever, it's their call) in order to help each other out against the big guilds, and guilds within an alliance can agree not to meddle with each other's castles (I mean, not attacking but not helping either; just being apart and letting fair battles develope).

 

4) I have no idea about Doram Cat Race, so no opinion regarding that one.

 

5) The fix on SD's cast time sounds good in order to avoid abuse. Many think it would deem Mechanics useless or less useful, but it won't. increasing cast time would only bring balance; Suicidal Destruction is OP on itself (because of the amount of inflicted damage), but you don't even see it coming and almost every time the mech explodes before you can even see what's happening. There's that, plus abusing them as alts. So increasing the fixed cast time of the skill would help to avoid that kind of thing, but Suras and other classes can still immovilize you and let the mech have its way, so it's not actually deeming them less useful, just trickier/harder to use in order to wipe the enemy. Making the cast of SD stoppable should be on the table too, but would need further review.

 

6) Total agreement regarding Stasis not being able to work through walls. Many abuse alts, and it is a problem; most alts don't have a full set of reductions (if any equipment at all, though I'm not saying it's always the case), so being able to place an alted Warlock behind the safety of a wall in order to cast Stasis succesfully isn't fair at all; you get Stasis no matter what and that's it, can't even fight it. Instead, forcing people to use Stasis by getting close to the people they want to disable (not "close" behind a wall), actually gives the targeted people a chance to avoid it; if it's an unequipped alt, they kill it easily and it could reduce alt abuse, and if it's someone playing Warlock as a main (or a well-geared alt) and they can't stop him, then they get Stasis in a "fair way".

 

7) Not sure about how the SP cost of the Masquerade line of skills would be of any help, but I'm not really that knowledgeable regarding Shadow Chasers, so no opinion here. Some people suggested increasing their cast delay in previous posts, but that would be a huge nerf on the class since you need many attempts to masquerade certain classes/builds/players, so it's kind of unfair (for example; I would love to incease the cast delay of Masquerade Gloomy, it's coming from a DB-oriented RK that hates having to bwing out of the castle to get the friggin' dragon back. But it's still unfair). Maybe there's a middle-ground.

 

8) Not sure about the potting issue either. A little testing should be done before implementing that kind of change. Even without macros or hacks some players are faster than others at spamming buttons, so it's unfair to punish them and make them less tanky (again, not sure if the potting delay can be compensated by the 25% increase in potion healing ability, hence the need to test). Maybe it is better to addres the hacking/autopotting/macros issue, though I personally don't think *certain* macros are bad (the other two are plain wrong, they automate the game. Macros on the other hand can vary a lot; with some, you automate certain aspects of the game and it's wrong, but with others you just make it easier/more confortable to use certain buttons -like using a mouse button instead of a keyboard button; you just change which part of your gaming set-up you use, you don't actually stop pressing buttons-).

 

9) No complaints about disabling monster transformation on WoE maps. It will be harder for some classes to hide and avoid being targeted by others, but it will also be harder for some classes to target without being targeted, so it balances itself.

 

I don't really have an opinion regarding the remaining suggestions, and right now I can't think of any new suggestions per se.

I guess that's it, just wanted to give my point of view.


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#248 WolfTri

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 10:20 PM

- Nerf Sura by abit in either Mobility or Damage.

Here I would strongly suggest taking away the damage rather than the mobility. I say this because one of the very core aspects of Monk/Champion/Sura classes is Snap. If you take that away, the class will simply never feel the same. I think it's a lot better to just make Gates of Hell and Tiger Cannon properly reducable, like I said earlier. 


Edited by WolfTri, 08 May 2016 - 10:20 PM.

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#249 PervySageMarty

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 11:05 PM

I say there is no reason to nerf or change anything in Dorams spirit priest class. They are made to cause mass buff and debuffs and nerfing that is simply making the class completely unplayable. Every guild having at least one Doram is a normal thing as much as having strings around are concerned.
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#250 sheepmia

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Posted 08 May 2016 - 11:06 PM

I think we should implement a RK dragon box item to get the dragon back after they are masq.

The idea is RK don't need to bwing every time they lost their dragon.

Make it so that it's nontrable and cannot be put into storage. The max amount of dragon box you can take with you is 2. Everytime you speak to the NPC it fills your boexs to 2 and aslo gives your dragon back.

So now they can be masq 3 times before they bwing out. But the box should have a fix cast time of 5s (can be interrupted) to get the dragon back otherwise masq gloomy becomes completely useless.

The idea is if RK lost their dragon they can go to a safe place and get the dragon back easily, for twice before resupplying
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