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AzzyAI 1.50 beta - 2/28 - Dev 17 posted, Eira fixes


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#326 Rirezz

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:11 AM

Ah, okay. I figured as much - I was just wondering if you found another workaround that I couldn't. I guess it'll just always be a drawback of using bow mercs, then, as they'll often need a lot of manual handling.
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#327 DrAzzy

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:40 AM

I just try to avoid maps with lots of dead cells when using bow mercenaries. There are only a few maps where it's really bad.
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#328 DarKAnonymous

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 06:00 PM

hi can i ask something why my homunculus stop auto attacking when i trans him to homun S help please

after i trans him*
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#329 DrAzzy

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:01 PM

hi can i ask something why my homunculus stop auto attacking when i trans him to homun S help please

after i trans him*

Edit, no OldHomunType may need to be set, but not setting it won't make it non-aggro.

Unless you have a really unusual config, i'd guess that you don't have my AI installed and are using the default AI, default AI does that.

Edited by DrAzzy, 11 March 2013 - 07:02 PM.

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#330 idkDave123

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 04:25 PM

Hey Azzy, I was wondering if there was a way to set my Homu to stand within one cell of my Gen when idle?
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#331 DrAzzy

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 02:26 PM

FollowStayBack sets the distance to which the homun will get to you before it stops moving. Set that to 1 instead of the default of 2.
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#332 deanoreadman3

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Posted 23 March 2013 - 11:25 PM

Hey. haven't posted in here for a while, but just want to say before I start I have a fully working AI install that is out of the program files folder and all that.

I'm also getting the Sera using up to 4 pain killers back to back for no reason bug that someone poped into the thread and mentioned and then didn't return when you asked for a traceai. I can do that for you because i'd really like to see it fixed but a quick couple of questions as she doesn't always bug out when she does it. Is it easyer if I wait to see if she does it with no mobs around to shorten the traceai or should I do it with mobs around which may spam a flood of other information?

Additionally I cannot seem to set my Sera up to Use called Legion automatically. The steps I followed to attempt to enable it were:
  • Set UseSeracallLegion to true on the Homunculus Tab
  • Looking at the mouse over tooltip I see mention of "set to Skill Class tactic CLASS_MINION
  • In Homunculus tactics I set up Orc Archers to React High use Attack Skills Always Debuff Never Kiting Never Skill Class Summon Minions. snipe ok unchecked, rescue Never, Chase Pause for SP.
Like this she does not call the legion on the archer even with 1000 sp (so reserve SP for AoE isn't the problem). the reasion I highlighted class minion and summon minions is because of the missmatch it terminology in case it is a problem somewhere in the coding, I realise a tooltip isnt the same as anything significant in the code but just in case. Finally on the subject was there anything else I needed to do to use summon legion automatically? It could just as easyly be that I have missed something.

Edited by deanoreadman3, 23 March 2013 - 11:27 PM.

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#333 DrAzzy

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 09:59 AM

Hey. haven't posted in here for a while, but just want to say before I start I have a fully working AI install that is out of the program files folder and all that.

I'm also getting the Sera using up to 4 pain killers back to back for no reason bug that someone poped into the thread and mentioned and then didn't return when you asked for a traceai. I can do that for you because i'd really like to see it fixed but a quick couple of questions as she doesn't always bug out when she does it. Is it easyer if I wait to see if she does it with no mobs around to shorten the traceai or should I do it with mobs around which may spam a flood of other information?

Additionally I cannot seem to set my Sera up to Use called Legion automatically. The steps I followed to attempt to enable it were:

  • Set UseSeracallLegion to true on the Homunculus Tab
  • Looking at the mouse over tooltip I see mention of "set to Skill Class tactic CLASS_MINION
  • In Homunculus tactics I set up Orc Archers to React High use Attack Skills Always Debuff Never Kiting Never Skill Class Summon Minions. snipe ok unchecked, rescue Never, Chase Pause for SP.
Like this she does not call the legion on the archer even with 1000 sp (so reserve SP for AoE isn't the problem). the reasion I highlighted class minion and summon minions is because of the missmatch it terminology in case it is a problem somewhere in the coding, I realise a tooltip isnt the same as anything significant in the code but just in case. Finally on the subject was there anything else I needed to do to use summon legion automatically? It could just as easyly be that I have missed something.


As long as the traceai is running while it bugs out, and as long as you include the other log files, it doesn't matter if there's a lot going on on-screen.

It's called "CLASS_MINION" internally, but the GUI displays it as "summon minions" to make it more human readable. There are lots of examples like that; the tooltip should be fixed to use the name the GUI calls that tactic.
I will see if I can get call legion to work. What you describe should work.
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#334 deanoreadman3

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 09:09 PM

Another AI bug is that if Sera is set to use painkiller ASAP (and this could very well be true for the other modes) and there is one of the following on the one specific cell she wants to stand on to cast painkiller
  • Another Player
  • Merc
  • Monster
  • Dead Cell
She will stand at her current location (no matter how far away) and stop reacting to anything including all of the the below until either the cell clears or you die:
  • she will no longer fight back against monsters attacking her
  • she will no longer fight back against monsters attacking you
  • she will no longer recast her AoE
  • she will not return to you
The reason why I think no one has reported this to you earlyer is that if you are actively playing and something is in that cell you will either A kill it yourself of B you are moving around and so the cell next to you will momentarily become empty again as you move which will make her spring back into life. Where as alchemists in Orc Dungeon AFK have the following reasons, they are either not looking at the screen at all and chalk any deaths up to nothing too serious or the mob blocking the cell can very easyly be a non aggressive looter such a Steel Chonchon or Zenorc which will, after a few seconds move away and the AI will resume as normal. If it is for a example a Orc Skeleton you will eventally die unattended.

My suggestion is either to have her dance some cells when using painkiller (if she cannot cancel her own cast by moving) but that has the problem of if something is in the dance cell....same issue. Or to have her attack move into the cell she wants to painkiller from which she would then have to track if the monster there is dead before attempting to Painkiller again.

I have some good news that you may or may not know about painkiller though. Back when I played around Feb 2012 I think it was and was making threads in the AI forum Painkiller could not be recast early in any way as the buff timer would not be refreshed so you made the AI start the cast for it so that the cast would end and be rebuffed about 0.2 seconds after the previous one would run out. This is no longer the case! Painkiller can now be refreshed anytime during the duration to be rebuffed back up to full! So I suggest that the timers be changed to instead of 0.2 seconds after the duration is over to One second before the buff even runs out to permit for the homunculus to be at the maximum distance away from you and the travel time added for that.

On a similar note it feels like the timer for the ground based AoE may be off as they are not done quite back to back but I suppose I will have to check that it is even the duration as cooldown before I commit to saying its an actual bug, they may just be diffrent values is the cooldown on the AoE the same as the duration? what I'd like to see if it is a AoE priority the same as the "UseSeraPainkiller ASAP" selection for the AoE but have them listed as ASAP Priority 1 and ASAP Priority 2 so if you are in a easy area AoE constancy is prioritized over Painkiller priority, but if painkiller is moved to be cast one second earlyer like I suggest they probably would never be a conflict anyway.

I sent you some AI related files, but they are rather long. Next time should I delete AAI_ERROR, AAI_SKILLFAIL AAIStartH before bug submitting? :P

EDIT: was musing over this a little bit earlyer, what is the actual range on Painkiller? if she is able to cast it from one extra cell away from the blocked space it would suceed more often because mobs generally attack from 1 cell, 3 cells or much further away if she could stan 2 cells away and cast it that would generally work? all moot if the cast distance is 1 cell ofcourse :S

Edited by deanoreadman3, 25 March 2013 - 03:17 AM.

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#335 DrAzzy

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 07:17 AM

Current to-do list:
  • Update docs
  • Update FAQ on website
  • Fix issue with Amistr Bulwark
  • Improve handling of dance attack + rescue and dropped targets.
  • Fix issue with timeout of mental charge getting reset
  • Investigate possible issue with level 9 sword mercenary
  • Investigate possible issue with call legion
  • Investigate possible issue with skill fail detection on mercenaries (specifically guard)
  • Fix issue with ASAP loop on targeted buff skills
  • Investigate issue with skill fail detection on painkiller


Another AI bug is that if Sera is set to use painkiller ASAP (and this could very well be true for the other modes) and there is one of the following on the one specific cell she wants to stand on to cast painkiller

  • Another Player
  • Merc
  • Monster
  • Dead Cell
She will stand at her current location (no matter how far away) and stop reacting to anything including all of the the below until either the cell clears or you die:
  • she will no longer fight back against monsters attacking her
  • she will no longer fight back against monsters attacking you
  • she will no longer recast her AoE
  • she will not return to you
The reason why I think no one has reported this to you earlyer is that if you are actively playing and something is in that cell you will either A kill it yourself of B you are moving around and so the cell next to you will momentarily become empty again as you move which will make her spring back into life. Where as alchemists in Orc Dungeon AFK have the following reasons, they are either not looking at the screen at all and chalk any deaths up to nothing too serious or the mob blocking the cell can very easyly be a non aggressive looter such a Steel Chonchon or Zenorc which will, after a few seconds move away and the AI will resume as normal. If it is for a example a Orc Skeleton you will eventally die unattended.

My suggestion is either to have her dance some cells when using painkiller (if she cannot cancel her own cast by moving) but that has the problem of if something is in the dance cell....same issue. Or to have her attack move into the cell she wants to painkiller from which she would then have to track if the monster there is dead before attempting to Painkiller again.

Issue has been reported before and is known. It's a difficult one to fix, though (I respond in PM about it too)

I have some good news that you may or may not know about painkiller though. Back when I played around Feb 2012 I think it was and was making threads in the AI forum Painkiller could not be recast early in any way as the buff timer would not be refreshed so you made the AI start the cast for it so that the cast would end and be rebuffed about 0.2 seconds after the previous one would run out. This is no longer the case! Painkiller can now be refreshed anytime during the duration to be rebuffed back up to full! So I suggest that the timers be changed to instead of 0.2 seconds after the duration is over to One second before the buff even runs out to permit for the homunculus to be at the maximum distance away from you and the travel time added for that.

Never knew this didn't work before. As long as my AI has had decent support for it, PK has been refreshable.

On a similar note it feels like the timer for the ground based AoE may be off as they are not done quite back to back but I suppose I will have to check that it is even the duration as cooldown before I commit to saying its an actual bug, they may just be diffrent values is the cooldown on the AoE the same as the duration? what I'd like to see if it is a AoE priority the same as the "UseSeraPainkiller ASAP" selection for the AoE but have them listed as ASAP Priority 1 and ASAP Priority 2 so if you are in a easy area AoE constancy is prioritized over Painkiller priority, but if painkiller is moved to be cast one second earlyer like I suggest they probably would never be a conflict anyway.

AzzyAI assumes the duration is slightly longer than it actually is, this is intended and helps to prevent situations where it tries to recast too early and gets confused.

You want two different ASAP priorities? Sorry, please use one of the other priorities for the less important buff, I'm not going to add two ASAP priorities. ASAP buff use is not something i want to encourage or expand; emergency handling like this always invites bugs, and I have my hands full getting ASAP to work as is, see above.

I sent you some AI related files, but they are rather long. Next time should I delete AAI_ERROR, AAI_SKILLFAIL AAIStartH before bug submitting? :P

Yes, please do. Good god....

EDIT: was musing over this a little bit earlyer, what is the actual range on Painkiller? if she is able to cast it from one extra cell away from the blocked space it would suceed more often because mobs generally attack from 1 cell, 3 cells or much further away if she could stan 2 cells away and cast it that would generally work? all moot if the cast distance is 1 cell ofcourse :S

Range is 1 cell, otherwise the whole thing would be much easier.

Edited by DrAzzy, 25 March 2013 - 08:31 AM.

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#336 deanoreadman3

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 04:07 AM

Sorry, If I knew ASAP was the source of problems I definately wouldn't have suggested more use of it. With the Painkiller cast timer what I was trying to mostly get at was that the recast is at 60 seconds (to finish at 60.2 or 61 seconds?) would it not be better to have her cast it or have the cast of it finish at 59 seconds? windows of error, travel time and second/half second of not having painkiller removed? If you don't think that is a good change or if the reason it is not refreshed quick enough is some kind of lag on my end where abouts could I edit it in the config to be cast at 59 seconds? :o I will probably do the same thing with Poison Mist and beta test if that can be chained atleast a little quicker without cast fails.

Its a real shame Painkiller isnt 2 cell range, conversely Summon Legion has an amazing cast range, seems to be anywhere on the edge of the screen to the other edge!

one other intresting oddity that I have noticed is that Sera seems to be able channel and cast Needle of Paralyze whilst moving! I had a suspension of disbeleif moment the first times I saw it and i'm still not sure It was intended, at first I thought it was position lag but I have for example seen her attacking a Zenorc and shoot a Orc Archer with Needle of Paralzya on the way over to a Orc Skeleton a few cells away from that first Zenorc to melee it all whilst litterally being in the correct respective tiles to attack the mobs where they were. All of these instances of moving Paralyze Needle have been with with the Snipe Ok and Snipe (low/med/high)Tactics

Edit: my description felt a little garbage re-reading it, so i'll say it like this, when moving from monster A to B she seems to be quite happy to move and cast paralyze needle on monster C if set to snipe tactics and if it is in range and on the route. happened enough times in a not laggy situation to be mentioned

Other weirdness is summon legions mobs sometimes just stay perfectly agro instead of just staying on one target an becoming inactive.

and finally why is using Summon Legion exclusive just out of intrest, surely she can/should be doing other things too

Edit: If you need someone to test alpha stuff that you would rather have an extra person test running then i'm always around, not really looking to get super secret early versions or anything and i'm expecting broken versions if that was the case, but if thats not the way you like to work no hard feelings :P

Edited by deanoreadman3, 26 March 2013 - 07:00 AM.

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#337 DrAzzy

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 07:06 AM

I'll shorten what the AI thinks the duration of painkiller is so it will keep it up 100% of the time - since it can be recast there's no reason not to (I thought I did this, but apparently I didn't). Poison mist on the other hand FAILS when the mist is still up, and so I'd rather not do it with that. Also, keeping poison mist up 100% of the time is not a matter of survival, while keeping painkiller up may be.

Yeah, there's currently no range limit on summon legion. This may get changed when the skill balance patch on sakray hits mains (they're fixing a similar bug for some other skills)

Under certain combinations of lag it is possible to get the homun to do other things while casting a skill. It's a little tricky to reproduce consistently, and I would not want to try systematically exploiting this.

Correct behavior is for the bugs to stay aggro. The bug is the majority case when they go inactive (AzzyAI tries to detect when the bugs are and aren't bugged - it won't recast summon legion unless its bugs are bugged).

Not sure what you mean by the last question?

Edited by DrAzzy, 26 March 2013 - 07:07 AM.

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#338 deanoreadman3

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 07:40 AM

Correct behavior is for the bugs to stay aggro. The bug is the majority case when they go inactive (AzzyAI tries to detect when the bugs are and aren't bugged - it won't recast summon legion unless its bugs are bugged).


Intresting, the description on the skill kind of says they will attack the target and then they are suppost to go inactive.

"Summon a group of bugs, and attack 1 target enemy"

I supose that is rather ambiguous are the bugs attacking one enemy in the sense that that are not attacking multiple enemies and concentrating on one or Will they attack one enemy and then stop attacking and stand around passive? Which is what they did more often than not,

its intresting (to me) that the bug is the other way around and that they are suppost to continue being active.


Not sure what you mean by the last question?


Do you not consider any of the changes you make Alpha rather than Beta? that could use quick feild testing? Stable Versions vs Unstable Versions that you would like to test quickly?

Edit: or did you mean my other question where I said why can the tactics not use call legion and something else? like why can you not have the tactic call legion and homunculus S skills or call legion and non-homunculus S skills, why is the tactic to summon legion and no supplementary skills.

Edited by deanoreadman3, 26 March 2013 - 07:45 AM.

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#339 DrAzzy

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 12:21 PM

Where did you get that from? Were you reading the skill descriptions or something?

Never do that, they weren't even accurate in the original korean, and they got translated by people who neither speak english nor play RO. Skill descriptions in game and on the website should not be taken as an authoritative resource.

When i asked about the last part, I hadn't seen you offering to beta test. I was talking about the:

"and finally why is using Summon Legion exclusive just out of intrest, surely she can/should be doing other things too"

I will definitely take you up on your offer of beta testing, because you seem real good at reproducing bugs.
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#340 deanoreadman3

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 02:28 PM

Where did you get that from? Were you reading the skill descriptions or something?


Yeah that is the current right-click live description of Call Legion on Chaos I'll keep in mind from now on that it's non-cannon flavour text :P

"and finally why is using Summon Legion exclusive just out of intrest, surely she can/should be doing other things too"


Ah, well its just that you can choose for skill class in the tactics list to either use Non-Homun S Skills, or Homun S Skills or Summon Minions. As I have the problem at the moment where when the tactic is set to Summon Minions she doesn't summon said minions she does nothing but auto attack

This got me to thinking that in an ideal situation Summon Minions should be a tick box for preference exactly like the React to Casts and Snipe OK tick boxes on the Homunculus Tactics page because in addition to summoning minions you will want your homunculus to also (varying monster to monster) either use no skills or Homun S skills or Non-Homun S skills.

She might even have a pretty good Damage Per Second on monsters over level 100 whilst maintaining 5 Summoned Lucia Vesper every 60 seconds and Needle of Paralyze each time that if off of cooldown asuming she can flee the monster atleast 70% of the time to get the cast off until the monster is dead.

I will definitely take you up on your offer of beta testing, because you seem real good at reproducing bugs.


Excellent, if you would like me to let you know my email in a private message you can reach me instantaniously as it self refreshes and I am always at my keyboard when I am awake or if you prefer you can send me anything through the forums and i'll almost certainly see it within the hour of sending.



End of Post Ramble: I really believe that alot of what Sera can do is quite underrated and that she has alot more function that Pain Killer slave, I think call legion is one of the spells I was most looking foward to and it would be fantastic to receive some more complex AI oppertunities from kRO. Either having them function to automatically follow/defend/attack whatever Sera is currently on or have them commandable by us the player through the AI program.

Other things such as the blind effect on Poison Mist, I am constantly hearing the sound effect of the blind working which as we know ruins the hit and flee chance of the person struck, it quite often sends looters straight back into non agressive and back out of the AoEonly to have them return into it a few seconds later to take another tick of damage without them having dealt anything to the player.

Lastly that I can think of off the top of my head is the Paralyze from Needle of Paralyze, again if it works on a monster that is incoming and hasn't reached you you have lowered the amount of attackers by one, I think where alot of people overlook this is that if they even turn the skill on at all (I know i Know it can be interuped) they have their homunculus run at the target that is held which really doesn't do anything in that case as it doesn't affect the monsters ability to attack, but! if you have set up the homunculus to change targets to higher priority monsters that are closer and/or sniping tactics then you can shut down a melee mob at a distance while you and your pet fight something else.

I also think the tooltip is wrong for the effects of the Paralyze, it says the duration can be reduced by VIT and LUK and that the chance to occur is 65% which is why most people discussing it that I have seen have said its useless because you'll start fighting monsters with 100 vit which would be a fair assumption if the tooltip is correct perhaps. But I submit that instead of:
  • Duration Reduced by ViT / LUK Chance 65%
it is infact (speculation)
  • Chance Reduced by VIT / LUK Base Chance 65% before reduction.
brief summary of monsters I have seen it on

http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1401/ Shinobi 55 VIT 30 LUK
http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1404/ Miyabi Doll 30 VIT 40 LUK
http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1405/ Tengu 40 VIT 60 LUK
http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1375/ The Paper 30 VIT 5 LUK
http://db.irowiki.or...ster-info/1148/ Medusa 65 VIT 15 LUK

as you can see, I haven't tried it out on the speculated 100 vit immunes but on all of these monsters you might expect quite diffrent variations in the duration of the hold? but there was none as far as I could tell with the human eye which supports my theory.

fighting things over level 100 are a pain in the butt for the homunc sometimes so I might look through the database for a non-boss flagged mob with closer to 100 VIT, just needs to be something she doesn't one shot and i've only really got her leveling recently, might be something I test with the AI off and Needle on my Hotbar while running away.

The supposed formulae of VIT and LUK affecting it is the same as many status's on the IRO wiki page, I wonder if there are any good and intresting correlations between the stats not reducing things like they are supposed to

Edited by deanoreadman3, 26 March 2013 - 02:43 PM.

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#341 DrAzzy

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 06:57 PM

My feeling with using the bees only was that the best use was to have it snipe with the bees, since the bees are so prone to bugging out after killing one thing, it's a waste to have the homun attack the target normally (in most cases...), since that'll get less milage out of the bugs.

What would happen if you sent the bees after a slow moving MVP and then walked off screen while keeping homun out? Would the MVP teleport? Would the bees keep hitting it off screen? Would you get exp if they killed it?


Funny, I've never noticed the paralyze effect....

Also, level difference will likely effect paralyze chance too - if homun level is higher, it will be able to inflict status even on 100 vit, while if monster is higher, chance to inflict is dramatically lower.
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#342 deanoreadman3

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 11:29 PM

Definately with general user use which is to sit in OD2 you would never have a use for Vespa's at all, and If it comes to the point where the creation of the AI is solely for OD2 then nothing further is needed unless they put Orc Lord back down there amongst the skeletons and throwback Orcs :P Infact the only reason I discovered I could not cast Vespa's through the AI was just because I happened to be on a lazy day down there and Orc Archers we're the biggest thing there.

Amongst those that on occasion do venture out into the world beyond orcs with a Sera I really think Vespa's + Other skills has its place, I saw a reply you gave to a Eira user in one thread about how they could use the homunculus's non decaying flee per opponent factor in conjunction with her flee skill in order to tank everything en masse but that there isnt away to use walk-ahead which would leave them with the only option to manually click ahead all the time.. what a drag.

But! we are talking about Sera she gives you the user the way to stand at the front and not worry about multitudes of mobs and its even better because there is always the potential to be wearing better gear in addition to painkiller and better gear is something it looks like pets will never have. So i'll get on with it, in a theoretical situation lets say you wanted to tank your pet a Bradium Golem, one at a time, you receive Painkiller you have her using Vespa's and tracking their 60 seconds durations and you have her using Paralyze Needle as close to back to back as possible and you either have her on do not chase a couple of cells behind you to keep her safe or you have her set to use auto attacks too increasing her DPS even further. I think its unfortunate that with the GUI this is not currently an option as you can only use one or the other with regards to Vespa's or Needle, B.Golems was just an example that may have a flaw if you look at it as a specific.

To surmize can you use Vespa's and something now? no. Will the average user use them if you add the option? probably not. Do I think it has it's place probably yes.

I'd like to know the effects of the Vespa's on MvP's too its very interesting and I do intend to find out. I'm also very curious about what Korea is doing for AI amongst their community, do they have the one guy on it like yourself? do they get any extras in their API? is there any upcoming changes or fixes to Homunc? Do they use your AI? So much to wonder about.

I didn't expect anyone to have noticed the paralyze effect, lets say because of the stigma of SP cost and interupt chance the people using Needle represent 1% and the people who have it turned on outside of areas where they one shot the mob with it so will not see the status anyway 0.5% and then the people who have it turned on who do not have their homunculus moving to the Paralzyed target anyway (making it impossible to see that it has gone off) 0.0001% :P that and my speculation that stats of opponent VIT/LUK defend against chance rather than duration like above, and if so you may have people give up before they see it.

I mean for all intents and purposes the Paralyze is almost exactly the same as giving a Novice or Swordsman Ankle Snare from Hunters to use in one on one situations would be absurd, you trap the monster stopping nothing but its movement and none of its combat abbilitys.....and then you have to move to it to hit it anyway. ofcourse in multiple combat (lets say 2 Monsters) if you trapped one and then attacked the other you have halfed your incoming damage potential, and this example works for both mythical Ankle Snare Novice and a Sera if you set it up in the AI with say use Paralyze Needle on High Orc's on Attack_Medium and switch to higher prioty targets if closer with Attack_High on Orc Archers.

High Orc spawns and runs on the screen, is paralyzed by needle, Orc Archer Spawns Closer and is switched to while High Orc is helplessly stuck.

Even works on same time mobs, you could set rescue_me from 1+ monsters, or rescue_me from specific things and have it come back to save you after Paralyzing an opponent from a distance.

I like how base level comes into status effects in the manner you described, is this a strickly PvM thing, of if some theoretical people in WoE or PvP for example were level 160 using status effects on level 150's with 100 VIT would they no longer get the immunity privalage?

Edited by deanoreadman3, 28 March 2013 - 11:39 PM.

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#343 DrAzzy

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 06:12 AM

Definately with general user use which is to sit in OD2 you would never have a use for Vespa's at all, and If it comes to the point where the creation of the AI is solely for OD2 then nothing further is needed unless they put Orc Lord back down there amongst the skeletons and throwback Orcs :P Infact the only reason I discovered I could not cast Vespa's through the AI was just because I happened to be on a lazy day down there and Orc Archers we're the biggest thing there.

Amongst those that on occasion do venture out into the world beyond orcs with a Sera I really think Vespa's + Other skills has its place, I saw a reply you gave to a Eira user in one thread about how they could use the homunculus's non decaying flee per opponent factor in conjunction with her flee skill in order to tank everything en masse but that there isnt away to use walk-ahead which would leave them with the only option to manually click ahead all the time.. what a drag.

I honestly have no idea how i'd implement walk-ahead behavior. I've really wanted to do this for a long time, but I just can't figure out how to implement it...

But! we are talking about Sera she gives you the user the way to stand at the front and not worry about multitudes of mobs and its even better because there is always the potential to be wearing better gear in addition to painkiller and better gear is something it looks like pets will never have. So i'll get on with it, in a theoretical situation lets say you wanted to tank your pet a Bradium Golem, one at a time, you receive Painkiller you have her using Vespa's and tracking their 60 seconds durations and you have her using Paralyze Needle as close to back to back as possible and you either have her on do not chase a couple of cells behind you to keep her safe or you have her set to use auto attacks too increasing her DPS even further. I think its unfortunate that with the GUI this is not currently an option as you can only use one or the other with regards to Vespa's or Needle, B.Golems was just an example that may have a flaw if you look at it as a specific.

To surmize can you use Vespa's and something now? no. Will the average user use them if you add the option? probably not. Do I think it has it's place probably yes.

These are all going to end up wasting most of the vespas due to the homun killing the monster too fast, though. I guess I'd need two new tactics, one for Legion + Pre S and one for Legion + S skills

I'd like to know the effects of the Vespa's on MvP's too its very interesting and I do intend to find out. I'm also very curious about what Korea is doing for AI amongst their community, do they have the one guy on it like yourself? do they get any extras in their API? is there any upcoming changes or fixes to Homunc? Do they use your AI? So much to wonder about.

Don't know if they use my AI. Their API is the same as we have, and sucks just as much. They broke require at some point recently, hence why AzzyAI switched to dofile() which is a better match anyway. Only fixes to homun that I'm aware of are the ones coming next teus in the big thread in the renewal news forum (just VA monster AI exploit fixed, SB use on emp + MVP fixed, so those skills will get re-enabled)

I didn't expect anyone to have noticed the paralyze effect, lets say because of the stigma of SP cost and interupt chance the people using Needle represent 1% and the people who have it turned on outside of areas where they one shot the mob with it so will not see the status anyway 0.5% and then the people who have it turned on who do not have their homunculus moving to the Paralzyed target anyway (making it impossible to see that it has gone off) 0.0001% :P that and my speculation that stats of opponent VIT/LUK defend against chance rather than duration like above, and if so you may have people give up before they see it.

I mean for all intents and purposes the Paralyze is almost exactly the same as giving a Novice or Swordsman Ankle Snare from Hunters to use in one on one situations would be absurd, you trap the monster stopping nothing but its movement and none of its combat abbilitys.....and then you have to move to it to hit it anyway. ofcourse in multiple combat (lets say 2 Monsters) if you trapped one and then attacked the other you have halfed your incoming damage potential, and this example works for both mythical Ankle Snare Novice and a Sera if you set it up in the AI with say use Paralyze Needle on High Orc's on Attack_Medium and switch to higher prioty targets if closer with Attack_High on Orc Archers.

High Orc spawns and runs on the screen, is paralyzed by needle, Orc Archer Spawns Closer and is switched to while High Orc is helplessly stuck.

Even works on same time mobs, you could set rescue_me from 1+ monsters, or rescue_me from specific things and have it come back to save you after Paralyzing an opponent from a distance

More a matter of stuff not living long enough to see the paralyze effect, I think. I rarely use homun for monsters that have so much hp that they're stil lstanding after a needle? Is there a feature request in here somewhere? I can't really tell, but I'm going to assume there isn't.

I like how base level comes into status effects in the manner you described, is this a strickly PvM thing, of if some theoretical people in WoE or PvP for example were level 160 using status effects on level 150's with 100 VIT would they no longer get the immunity privalage?

It's true in WoE/PVP too - and I think it's very damaging to the game, honestly - status effects are so common in woe, and immunity to stun is so important, you're just wasting your time if you show up to woe on something that's not 150, otherwise you'll just get stunlocked and stand there watching helplessly while you and your guild gets slaughtered (or slaughters the enemy without you). Either way, it's not fun, and this "woe sucks if you're not 150" dynamic is what forced the GMs to make leveling so easy on Renewal, since WoE is the most compelling arena of gameplay for many people.


Edited by DrAzzy, 29 March 2013 - 06:14 AM.

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#344 fr0stn0va

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 07:12 AM

ty so much!
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#345 DrAzzy

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 10:17 AM

Ugh, fixing the ASAP loop is hard...
And one half of the fix for it is already in - we try to move straight to the target to get into range if we're having trouble getting into range. I wonder why it doesn't work...

Found the cause of the issue with dance attack dropping targets though, I think. My Adjust() functions made an invalid assumption about the relative positioning of the actors in question, which could cause them to move to locations out of range of the target.

Edited by DrAzzy, 29 March 2013 - 11:01 AM.

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#346 AnthonyMar14

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 08:38 AM

Uhmm.. I just noticed that I can't open my AzzyAIConfig. Any help plz?
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#347 DrAzzy

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 08:40 AM

Uhmm.. I just noticed that I can't open my AzzyAIConfig. Any help plz?


Uh, what happens? Do you get any error messages?
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#348 AnthonyMar14

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 03:31 PM

Uh, what happens? Do you get any error messages?




It says.. "To run this application, you must first install one of the following versionsof the .NET framework: v4.0.30319
Contact your application publisher for instructionsabout obtaining the appropriate version of the .NET framework."

Did I install it the wrong way or something else? plz help :sob: Thanks again! :thx:
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#349 DrAzzy

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 03:40 PM

Download and install the Microsoft .NET Framework version 4 from Microsoft website (pick the x86+x64 version for 64 bit windows, x86 for 32-bit/x86 windows)
http://www.microsoft.com/net/download

Edited by DrAzzy, 31 March 2013 - 03:41 PM.

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#350 AnthonyMar14

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 04:15 PM

Download and install the Microsoft .NET Framework version 4 from Microsoft website (pick the x86+x64 version for 64 bit windows, x86 for 32-bit/x86 windows)
http://www.microsoft.com/net/download



Thank you so much! It's working now! Best AI ever! :p_love:
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